Promoting Yourself

[NidanWarrior]

Iv'e seen it or heard of it far too often in the martial arts community, people getting promoted faster than McDonalds can open a new drive through. But what really gets me is when a black belter goes out on his/her own and either promotes himself to a higher (sometimes much higher) degree or that person finds group of other black belts and they promote him. What does one get from this? Does it make you/them feel superior just because of the rank? Pretty sad if you need that kind of boost. Myself, I'd rather work hard, enjoy my training and comradery of the martial arts and when my instructor wants to promote me, fine. What do you all think about this? Have you ro do you know of someone like this? Just curious, maybe I'm missing something.

[SBN Doug]

Fortunately, I've never had the disspleasure of studying at any of those type of dojang.

[Tombstone]

well if Jean Claude Van Damme can do it, i guess anyone can

[omnifinite]

I don't know anyone who's given themselves a rank. I wouldn't even know how it would be done beyond forging documents or just plain lying. I think I'd personally be a little afraid to suddenly start calling myself a 5th dan. If a real high-ranker decided to try me out (probably to expose me) and came at me like they'd come at a 5th dan, well, nice little hospital stay for me.

[Pyros]

It's not always a case of forgery. Often a (hypothetical) guy has 1st dan in TKD and 1st dan in Judo and also has a huge need for immediate gratification. Thus he launches his own organization creating a new martial art style "Han Kuk Sool Hwang Do" combining TKD and Judo techniques and suddenly he has a curriculum up to 5th dan with himself already ranked at the top. All legal. All common.

[omnifinite]

Hmm. To have a new style be truly legit doesn't it have to be reviewed by a soke/headfounder council or something? Or is that just naive wishful thinking? That's the only calibre I'd personally accept when considering studying a recently developed style.

[Pyros]

Style, yes. A new art, no. If you want to start a new karate style or tae kwon do style or jujutsu style, if you want it to be recognized you have to go to the (a) head organization of that art. But if you start a completely new art, say Onidokan Budo (let's assume such an art doesn't accidentally exist.. ) there's no head organization to ask. You are the organization! You start the World International Onidokan Budo Association and name yourself it's chairman. Then you get some students and start teaching. There really is noone you answer to, as long as you don't lie to people. Just say it out lout: In the year 2003 I founded a new art. Period.

[Karateka_latino]

I don't really have a problem with that as long as the person is Prepared for surch responsability and also counts with the credibility of other martial artists and head organizations.

 

As long as it works. Does really matter how its called?

[taebot]

Is this the black belt police posse?

 

Where do I sign up? I have LOTS of ideas on who should be what rank. For example, when I beat you in the ring, I should get your rank because you obviously didn't know as much as me! RIGHT?

 

Rank is internal to each school and system. If Joe Schmuckatello wants to go put a belt on, call himself a master, open a dojo, and start offering fries with each promotion what's it to you?

 

He's going to fail in the marketplace of ideas.

 

He's going to fail in competition.

 

He's going to fail with his own students because you can only fool a few of the people all of the time...

 

Let me ask you this KC nidan...

 

Suppose manana Mr. Steve Mackey decides he's been patient long enough with one Mr. Jim Harrison and tells the world, I'm a master and my rank is seventh degree? You may want to drive on over and tell him what you think of it, but I'm going to throw him a nice party and tell him, "It's about time, man... It's about time!"

 

When you're done checking out his credentials, you might want to go over to Ron Dotson Senior and ask him what gives HIM the right to be a black belt... :D

 

 

 

My point being that Martial Arts may be historical, may be hierarchical, may be a tradition handed down carefully from student to master for generations...

 

And then Joe Lewis comes along and rewrites the book completely. Or Bruce Lee, or the Krav Magna people, or even dumb 'ol Joe "I Just Promoted Myself" Schmuckatello.

 

Conversely, you get a guy like Gary McGee, a fantastic martial artist who struggles and practices for years without rank. So the KC martial arts community gets together and says, "Hey, Mr. McGee. Nice work. Here's a certificate signed by all of us saying as far as we're concerned you're a sixth degree. Congratulations."

 

Rank stinks.

 

[NidanWarrior]

Rank promotion is important, at least up to black belt. Promotion gives the student a sense of accomplishment, something to achieve, goals to reach.

 

I don't have a problem with people promoting themselves anymore. It will eventually catch up with them. As far as people like Mr. Mackey declareing himself a "master" and the rank of seventh dgree, hey I'm not going to argue one bit. He's been in the martial arts long enough to know where he stands. Those names you speak of, and I do know who they are, are not the level of martial artist I was refering to. I was talking more about those first and second degree black belts, and remember in some styles black belts are a dime-a-dozen and you can get one in about 2 years. (Not at my school you won't)

 

Let's look at it from another perspective. Look at it from inside your own organization. Say one person gets a black belt, goes out on his/her own and opens a school while you continue to train at the main school. After about two years the first person, who left to start a school, is sudenly no longer associated with the main school and is now say a 3rd or fourth degree. Myself, I don't care. But don't you think there is a slight loss of RESPECT for that person.

 

Just a thought.