gojuryu and bujikan

[brennan the rabbit]

would training in gojuryu and bujikan be a good or bad idea would they conflict with each other

[Zaine]

I don't really know enough about Bujikan to answer that question. However, what rank are you in Goju Ryu? I would say that the length of time you have done it is more important. Any new system will bring with it a demand for new muscle memory, and it might be frustrating as you're trying to work against your existing muscle memory to do those techniques properly.

I suggest that you talk with you CI about it. They will know, better than us, if it matches closely, and whether or not it would be viable to do for you.

[sensei8]

Well, both are MA, and imho, they're polar opposites to one another just from the face value of either of them.

Having said that, cross training is about learning something of value to the practitioner...YOU...and applying it effectively. They both desire the perfection of effective movements across the board.

Take what is useful, discard the rest.

Would they conflict one another? To me, that again depends on the practitioners current knowledge and experience. A beginner in either of these MA, will not know about subtle differences between them, and that can lead to the deer caught in the headlights mindset. However, if you've, for example, have a black belt in, i.e. Goju, then you'll be approaching the Bujikan with an eye towards details and understanding about the MA, and not have any preconceived notions about what to expect.

Do they mix well together? I believe that varies with the practitioner, and not with either of the styles.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Go visit whichever one you're interested in and go from there, but visit that school several times to get a more clearer picture of it.

Good luck, and please let us know what you decide.

[bushido_man96]

I'm not familiar with Bujikan, either. But, it just depends on your capacity to learn. If you feel you can do one without confusing the other, then by all means, go forward with it. But, you should really consider what it is you want to focus on in your MA training right now, and focus your energy into attaining that goal.

[Wado Heretic]

Is Bujikan a relatively obscure school of karate, or is it an unintended misspelling of Bujinkan? One I cannot help you with, while the other I can perhaps offer a little advice.

If it is an obscure form of karate; if it is full-contact, or shuri/tomari te based, then you might find it an effective addition to your Goju-Ryu training. Again; as other have said, you should consider your time, and whether it is more effective to divide your time, or focus purely on Goju-Ryu. Perhaps go to a lesson or two, and see if it does anything different; if not, it is perhaps not worth it.

If it is Bujinkan then I would say this; you will probably not learn anything barring some grappling techniques and some specific weapons, in Bujinkan that you would not find in Goju-Ryu. Goju-ryu also tends to have more realistic sparring, and self-defence, as well in my experience with it's practitioners.

The issue with the Takamatsu Den (The Nine Schools of the Bujinkan) is that of determining their authenticity. The schools of Kukishinden-Ryu, and Takagi Yoshin-Ryu, are likely authentic as there is significant evidence of Takamatsu being involved, and instructing, in these arts. Similarly; there is evidence of the main-lines acknowledging Takamatsu as a representative instructor of Kukishinden-Ryu and Takagi Yoshin-Ryu. It should also be remembered that for several generations the schools of Kukishinden-Ryu and Takagi Yoshin-Ryu were deeply intertwined even before Takamatsu and the later Bujinkan. Takamatsu was also recognised as an expert in Bojutsu and Jujutsu, the key disciplines of Kukishinden-Ryu and Takagi Yoshin-Ryu respectively, when he became a member of the Minoku Seinen Botoku-kai (Modern Budokan). As such; I believe there is little doubt that these two schools are authentic, and remain so even as part of the Bujinkan.

However; there is much ambiguity regarding the other claimed schools. Takamatsu likely did have training in Shinden Fudo-Ryu; it was readily available in his day and age, and was even practised in Britain at the turn of the century thanks to the efforts of one Barton Wright. Yet; there is little evidence to support Takamatsu being an actual expert in the discipline. Furthermore, there is little evidence of historical schools identifying themselves as Koto-Ryu, Gyokko-Ryu, or Gikan-Ryu thus bringing into doubt these schools of Koppo and Kosshi jutsu. Indeed, they are largely claimed to be source arts for Togakure-ryu, the core ninpo school of the Bujinkan; a system largely considered fraudulent with regards to claims about it's heritage, further bringing in to doubt any discipline associated with it. Also; the other Ninpo disciplines are similarly judged to be fraudulent with regards to their lineage claims.

All this said; it should be about whether a martial art is effective, and can add to your training. There is a letter from Takamatsu to the head of the Kukishinden-Ryu, requesting permission to add karate like elements to the jujutsu of Kukishinden-ryu and Takagi Yoshin-Ryu, based on his experiences in China. Similarly; Takamatsu was an open critic of Judo technique, and as such I believe he modified his jujutsu to answer the emerging martial paradigm as set by Karate, Judo, Kenpo, and Gendai Budo in general.

To summarise what I have said; there are only two authentic schools in the Bujinkan, and they have probably been modified significantly in response to Karate and Judo. As such, you are unlikely to find any thing in the Bujinkan that you will not find in Goju-Ryu, and with far less propaganda.

[LionsDen]

Training bukjinkan is a bad idea no matter what. It’s all a made up modern fraud.

[JazzKicker]

Reviving an old thread, a new school opened in my neighborhood, offering "Bujinkan Budō Taijutsu". 

The instructor claims to be 12th dan and training since 1986. I stopped by an open house briefly, he seems to be mid-40s, friendly and sincere. Looked like they did a lot of sword work (but no kendo gear). Nicely appointed room & mats inside an athletic center.

Looking up this Style, it gets complicated with lots of different ninja stuff, lineages & such. Seems fishy to me, the idea of a 12th dan seems like a bad Internet faker joke.

No plans to train there, just curious who's doing what in my area.

[Furinkazan]

14 hours ago, JazzKicker said:

Reviving an old thread, a new school opened in my neighborhood, offering "Bujinkan Budō Taijutsu". 

The instructor claims to be 12th dan and training since 1986. I stopped by an open house briefly, he seems to be mid-40s, friendly and sincere. Looked like they did a lot of sword work (but no kendo gear). Nicely appointed room & mats inside an athletic center.

Looking up this Style, it gets complicated with lots of different ninja stuff, lineages & such. Seems fishy to me, the idea of a 12th dan seems like a bad Internet faker joke.

No plans to train there, just curious who's doing what in my area.

If someone wants satiate the dreams of their inner eight year old, I could see the appeal.  But ninjas haven't been cool since waning of the popularity of the original Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles cartoon.  So I can't imagine that there'd be many people in ninjutsu/bujinkan schools under the age of 40.

[Wastelander]

On 1/5/2026 at 4:32 PM, JazzKicker said:

Reviving an old thread, a new school opened in my neighborhood, offering "Bujinkan Budō Taijutsu". 

The instructor claims to be 12th dan and training since 1986. I stopped by an open house briefly, he seems to be mid-40s, friendly and sincere. Looked like they did a lot of sword work (but no kendo gear). Nicely appointed room & mats inside an athletic center.

Looking up this Style, it gets complicated with lots of different ninja stuff, lineages & such. Seems fishy to me, the idea of a 12th dan seems like a bad Internet faker joke.

No plans to train there, just curious who's doing what in my area.

The Bujinkan increased the number of yudansha grades from 10 to 15, I think sometime in the 80s, so 12th Dan is a real rank in that organization, even though basically every other traditional art and organization only uses 10 yudansha grades.

As for the system, itself, it is largely cosplay. They present ninjutsu as if it is a specific martial art, but it isn't a martial art, at all. Ninjutsu is, essentially, spycraft--camouflage, disguise, poisons, assassination methods, etc. Real ninja/shinobi were just samurai who also learned spycraft, so the martial arts aspect of ninja/shinobi is literally just Japanese jujutsu, and every clan had their own system of jujutsu, some of which are still around, today. A lot of the material in the Bujinkan is pretty typical of most jujutsu styles, but a lot of it is definitely material that hasn't been pressure tested, and can get pretty esoteric. Masaaki Hatsumi supposedly learned several jujutsu systems and blended them together to create the Bujinkan's martial arts material, and I honestly don't know where he got the spycraft aspects, which they don't seem to actually do much of, but I suspect it is almost entirely taken from theater and film. The fact that they dress in stereotypical ninja garb reinforces that theory, because real ninja/shinobi did not dress that way, they dressed to blend in with the people they were going to be around while they were spying. The outfits they are wearing in the Bujinkan are Noh theater stagehand costumes, designed to make the stagehands disappear against a black backdrop. This became associated with ninja/shinobi because the way that Noh theater presented mysterious assassinations was by having a stagehand use a weapon to kill a character, so you were supposed to be seeing a weapon floating in the dark, and have no idea who was wielding it. That made people essentially assume that assassins would wear the same outfit so they could hide in the dark.