unDertow Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 I know lots of martial artists and lots of wrestlers. And they bot think they can beat each other up. Wretlers always think that if someone trys to kick them they will take them down and beat on them. Martial artists always think if a wrerstler trys to take them down they will be able to kick them first. I have cross-trianed in both but would like to see the opinion of the forum. punch kick shoot pound submitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiboxerken Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 One vs One.. the grappler will usually win. Many, many fights end up on the ground, even when both fighters don't want to go there. It just happens. Now, if a fighter decides that the ground is where he wants to go, it's very hard to stop him. Anyway, many martial arts don't even deal with preventing wrestling style take-downs because many martial arts don't even know how a wrestlers take-down works. So the "well I just won't let him take me down" strategy is in-valid and plain stupid. Realistically, to counter wrestling strategy, one must study what the wrestler is trying to do to you and then you can deal with them. My opinion is learn how to both wrestle (grapple) and strike and you'll be able to dictate the fight a little more effectively. Just kick 'em, they'll understand.- Me Apprentice Instructor under Guro Inosanto in Jun Fan Gung Fu and Filipinno Martial arts.Certified Instructor of Frank Cucci's Linxx system of martial arts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DIABLO Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 I agree with ken, that in order to stop the grappler you have to understand what he is trying to do. Do either of you guys or anyone no anything about shootboxing? keep your hands up!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiboxerken Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 Shootfighting is a MMA type of event. It involves elements of boxing, thaiboxing, kickboxing and grappling (jujitsu). I've had the pleasure of meeting retired, Light-Heavyweight shootfighting champion of 5 years in Japan, Eric Paulson. He is the man. Shootfighting is like UFC on speed. They only allow 30 seconds on the ground before standing them up again. It's a great sport to watch and is more technical than other MMA venues. Just kick 'em, they'll understand.- Me Apprentice Instructor under Guro Inosanto in Jun Fan Gung Fu and Filipinno Martial arts.Certified Instructor of Frank Cucci's Linxx system of martial arts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny boy Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 I agreeif a fighter wants to go to the ground it will happen,I have always been a striker but I have the utmost respect for wrestlers(I actually cross train now with some good guys in wrestling) As for who would win well that another "What if?" if its in the ring yes the grappler would 9 times out of 10,in the street though it maybe different,fighting has no formula,it is unpredictable. A friend of mine is a state ranked wrestler and he has no problems with another friend who is world ranked in MT when they spar NHB rules once they hit the mat..Can't name any names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Arahat Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 Alot of wrestlers will make some big mistakes in a fight. By wrestlers I assume we are talking collegiate types ie. greco-roman etc. Alot of wrestling teaches you to stablize and expose the back (remember the objective is to expose the opponents back to the mats). Also the lack of striking skills, and how to deal with a striker is never taught. This is all based on pure wrestling vs. pure stand up. The truth of the matter is that it comes down to how good you are. Look at the old UFC the Polar Bear vs. Ruas, even though skilled on the ground Ruas knew how to keep distance and won. Same with Mo' Smith vs Conan. Then look at Mark Coleman when he first started. It all comes down to awareness, and understanding what your up against Erik Paulson can be used as an example as well in the World Combat Championship (NHB Event) he lost to James Warring a Boxer, and was unable to take Warring to the ground. Then Warring lost to Renzo Gracie...on the ground... Martial Arts School http://www.shaolinwushu.cahttp://www.liveyyc.comCalgary Photographer: http://www.jdirom.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny boy Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 I believe it is easier to teach a wrestler to strike than to teach a striker to grapple.I wouldn't peg all wrestlers to be unable to punch or kick.some are quite good strikers. Even if they are average it will be enough to get their opponent to the mat in their comfort zone but like I said previously it can be unpredictable out there and sometimes the K.O. will come out of nowhere. Bottom line best to cross train with good people in all.my main skill area in hands and feet but every week I train with the grapplers to help my allround skill level. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unDertow Posted August 18, 2001 Author Share Posted August 18, 2001 You guys are right on track with the whole grappeling thing. But here's a new question. Which has better takedowns Wrestling, Judo, JuJitsu,hapkido,Akido, or anything else you can think of? punch kick shoot pound submitt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaiboxerken Posted August 19, 2001 Share Posted August 19, 2001 Depends on the situation. In competition and the ring, wrestlers have the best take-down.. but wrestlers tend to take a person down into "the guard". If you train in BJJ, you'll learn how to take a person down and hopefully end up in better position. Kali and Silat tend to take a person down while breaking things on the way. Overall though, if a person doesn't care how he takes you to the ground and what position they get into, it would be the wrestlers. Just kick 'em, they'll understand.- Me Apprentice Instructor under Guro Inosanto in Jun Fan Gung Fu and Filipinno Martial arts.Certified Instructor of Frank Cucci's Linxx system of martial arts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angus Posted August 19, 2001 Share Posted August 19, 2001 I think if u open a fight with a kick then u deserve to have your leg broken (unless it's a kick to the knee - roundhouse)... Any for of kick in the street that is used as a first strike is a bad idea, cos u never know when a grappler is gonna b on ur arse. It's very hard to take down someone who throws a roundhouse to the knee though. I actually tend to incorporate an initial lock with a basic strike and then i come in with roundhouses and knees and elbows etc... Angus Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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