Changes that effect traditions.

[MatsuShinshii]

Well... we had our instructors board meeting last night and it did not turn out as I expected.

I was ready to cast my vote to push a few votes forward after getting feed back from some of you when we were all told that they had enough votes to pass all issues without "wasting our time".

Our VP cut in and asked what this meant and how this transpired since we were dead locked on more than 90% of the issues. To this he was told, quite rudely I might add, that two of the board members came to their senses and sided with the him and told him that they would be voting yes across the board and that the days of old traditionalists were at an end.

I was quite taken back by the attitude and expressed that there was no need for mud slinging. I was told that the old ways were not the future for our organization and I could either get on board with progress or get left behind.

Our VP said that he was not going to sit back and let one person dictate to the rest of us. He said that we all have equal votes and no one has been appointed Soke, therefore no one has the right to over set our bylaws.

He was "somehow" disconnected from the on-line meeting. He never returned to the meeting. I got off line and let what had transpired sink in. I realized that with ALL of the issues being approved, I now teach for and belong to a McDojo.

I spoke with Kosei (our VP) today and told him that I was not comfortable with the way things are going and that I can not figure out how the president was able to convince two of our board members to vote for his changes. He told me that he too was not happy about the direction the president is leading us and said that he had a long conversation with him after the meeting. He said that he regrets to inform me of the fact that he is no longer the VP and in fact he is no longer a member of the association. He would not tell me what transpired during the conversation or what was said but told me that it was his decision to leave due to what the president told him.

He said that he is either going to take his students and just teach or he will start from scratch with new students if they wanted to stay with the association.

This came as a pretty big bomb shell to me. I begged him to reconsider but he said he could not stay knowing what he knows and not being able to stop it.

Sooooooooo... I guess I am a member of a Mcdojo now. Yep, we have the whole rainbow of belts, less time and requirements for Shodan, no testing for Rokudan and up, more fees, and yep, we now have kids.

Oh I forgot to mention that unbeknownst to myself and the VP the issue was changed to kids will be required. That's right, it's not the instructors choice it's a requirement, and here is the best part... there is a quota that we have to meet.

Oh and this just tickled me pink, the student and instructor manual that I wrote under Shinshii's request and direction will be replaced because, "it fosters the wrong message and is not conducive to growth within the organization". Isn't that great? Just makes me want to do some cart wheels!

I called our President and told him that I would not be teaching kids nor would I adhere to these changes within my Dojo, that I had more than enough students to literally teach to the day I die without needing to add kids. I was told that I did not have that option and that if I wanted to remain as a member of the board and of the association I would lead by example and adhere to these changes or I could choose to leave.

So needless to say I am at a point where I have to make a decision of whether I want to belong to something that goes against everything I have ever known or quit. McDojo or stick to Shinshii's standards. Gee thats a really hard decision.

Sorry for the sarcasm. I think I need some time to think about the positive and negative points of leaving the association before making a decision that effects not just me but my students as well.

I don't have the grade or teaching license to start my own thing so I would just teach as an independent. I need to figure out how this would effect my students. I also need to see if I can get in touch with our insurance company to see if I can get the same rates as the association. If not it doesn't look good for me to continue to teach. My students journey with me may be at an end if I decide I can't go along with these GREAT CHANGES!

I hate airing dirty laundry and normally would keep my off handed comments to myself but this just takes the cake and has broken the camels back. Hopefully you understand and do not hold my disdain for this situation against me.

I actually never saw this coming in a million years. I guess Shinshii's students were not as loyal as I thought. I can not tell you how disheartened I am by this and how utterly sad I feel that what Shinshii left in our hands has been destroyed in mere years. I really don't know what the next step is. Maybe I am a dinosaur. I have no respect for things like trophies, quick promotions for literally nothing, flashy kata that represent nothing, quantity over quality. I don't think I could go along with this. I have already made my decision but the only thing holding me back is that I am also making it for my family (students) that have not had the opportunity to express their feelings about it. I guess I fear that this will appeal to them and I know I just can not pass on this legacy of nothingness where money and numbers mean more than teaching the art. Maybe my beliefs are obsolete and stuck in a different time.

Well I guess I'll find out in tomorrows class when I pose the question to them. It's a lot to process and I kinda fear what they might say.

[The Pred]

Well... we had our instructors board meeting last night and it did not turn out as I expected.

I was ready to cast my vote to push a few votes forward after getting feed back from some of you when we were all told that they had enough votes to pass all issues without "wasting our time".

Our VP cut in and asked what this meant and how this transpired since we were dead locked on more than 90% of the issues. To this he was told, quite rudely I might add, that two of the board members came to their senses and sided with the him and told him that they would be voting yes across the board and that the days of old traditionalists were at an end.

I was quite taken back by the attitude and expressed that there was no need for mud slinging. I was told that the old ways were not the future for our organization and I could either get on board with progress or get left behind.

Our VP said that he was not going to sit back and let one person dictate to the rest of us. He said that we all have equal votes and no one has been appointed Soke, therefore no one has the right to over set our bylaws.

He was "somehow" disconnected from the on-line meeting. He never returned to the meeting. I got off line and let what had transpired sink in. I realized that with ALL of the issues being approved, I now teach for and belong to a McDojo.

I spoke with Kosei (our VP) today and told him that I was not comfortable with the way things are going and that I can not figure out how the president was able to convince two of our board members to vote for his changes. He told me that he too was not happy about the direction the president is leading us and said that he had a long conversation with him after the meeting. He said that he regrets to inform me of the fact that he is no longer the VP and in fact he is no longer a member of the association. He would not tell me what transpired during the conversation or what was said but told me that it was his decision to leave due to what the president told him.

He said that he is either going to take his students and just teach or he will start from scratch with new students if they wanted to stay with the association.

This came as a pretty big bomb shell to me. I begged him to reconsider but he said he could not stay knowing what he knows and not being able to stop it.

Sooooooooo... I guess I am a member of a Mcdojo now. Yep, we have the whole rainbow of belts, less time and requirements for Shodan, no testing for Rokudan and up, more fees, and yep, we now have kids.

Oh I forgot to mention that unbeknownst to myself and the VP the issue was changed to kids will be required. That's right, it's not the instructors choice it's a requirement, and here is the best part... there is a quota that we have to meet.

Oh and this just tickled me pink, the student and instructor manual that I wrote under Shinshii's request and direction will be replaced because, "it fosters the wrong message and is not conducive to growth within the organization". Isn't that great? Just makes me want to do some cart wheels!

I called our President and told him that I would not be teaching kids nor would I adhere to these changes within my Dojo, that I had more than enough students to literally teach to the day I die without needing to add kids. I was told that I did not have that option and that if I wanted to remain as a member of the board and of the association I would lead by example and adhere to these changes or I could choose to leave.

So needless to say I am at a point where I have to make a decision of whether I want to belong to something that goes against everything I have ever known or quit. McDojo or stick to Shinshii's standards. Gee thats a really hard decision.

Sorry for the sarcasm. I think I need some time to think about the positive and negative points of leaving the association before making a decision that effects not just me but my students as well.

I don't have the grade or teaching license to start my own thing so I would just teach as an independent. I need to figure out how this would effect my students. I also need to see if I can get in touch with our insurance company to see if I can get the same rates as the association. If not it doesn't look good for me to continue to teach. My students journey with me may be at an end if I decide I can't go along with these GREAT CHANGES!

I hate airing dirty laundry and normally would keep my off handed comments to myself but this just takes the cake and has broken the camels back. Hopefully you understand and do not hold my disdain for this situation against me.

I actually never saw this coming in a million years. I guess Shinshii's students were not as loyal as I thought. I can not tell you how disheartened I am by this and how utterly sad I feel that what Shinshii left in our hands has been destroyed in mere years. I really don't know what the next step is. Maybe I am a dinosaur. I have no respect for things like trophies, quick promotions for literally nothing, flashy kata that represent nothing, quantity over quality. I don't think I could go along with this. I have already made my decision but the only thing holding me back is that I am also making it for my family (students) that have not had the opportunity to express their feelings about it. I guess I fear that this will appeal to them and I know I just can not pass on this legacy of nothingness where money and numbers mean more than teaching the art. Maybe my beliefs are obsolete and stuck in a different time.

Well I guess I'll find out in tomorrows class when I pose the question to them. It's a lot to process and I kinda fear what they might say.

Sorry to hear that. You know if I were you I would just teach independent. What rank are you if you don't mind me asking?

[JR 137]

Will your heart really be in it if you stay? Will you really be teaching what Shinshii taught you and demanded from you and your students?

Are you loyal to a shell of a former organization or to the art Shinshii taught you and the standards at which he taught? Had he foreseen the current state, would he have granted these people (and you, if you choose to comply) the right to teach and carry on his art in the first place?

If the Rolex name was bought by Timex, and all Rolexes produced afterward were really just dressed up Timexes, would they still be Rolexes? Would you be comfortable selling these "Rolexes" to your loyal customers?

Granted, I'm only hearing your side of this, but I don't see anyone in their right mind complying with these changes for any length of time. Unless there's an issue of racism, sexism, etc., no organization should demand teachers teach anyone they don't want to teach, let alone establish a quota.

My organization has curricula for ages 4 and up. Our kaicho doesn't require that anyone teach any individual group nor all groups. He doesn't interfere in costs (I'm assuming provided no one is damaging the Seido Juku name or another Seido Juku dojo). His way of keeping teachers in check is holding them accountable when he tests the teachers' students for dan grades. If I were in charge, I'd run it the same way. If that made me a dinosaur, I'd happily walk around like a T. Rex all day.

[MatsuShinshii]

Sorry to hear that. You know if I were you I would just teach independent. What rank are you if you don't mind me asking?

I don't mind at all. My grade is Nanadan and hold a Kyoshi teaching license.

[MatsuShinshii]

Will your heart really be in it if you stay? Will you really be teaching what Shinshii taught you and demanded from you and your students?

Are you loyal to a shell of a former organization or to the art Shinshii taught you and the standards at which he taught? Had he foreseen the current state, would he have granted these people (and you, if you choose to comply) the right to teach and carry on his art in the first place?

If the Rolex name was bought by Timex, and all Rolexes produced afterward were really just dressed up Timexes, would they still be Rolexes? Would you be comfortable selling these "Rolexes" to your loyal customers?

Granted, I'm only hearing your side of this, but I don't see anyone in their right mind complying with these changes for any length of time. Unless there's an issue of racism, sexism, etc., no organization should demand teachers teach anyone they don't want to teach, let alone establish a quota.

My organization has curricula for ages 4 and up. Our kaicho doesn't require that anyone teach any individual group nor all groups. He doesn't interfere in costs (I'm assuming provided no one is damaging the Seido Juku name or another Seido Juku dojo). His way of keeping teachers in check is holding them accountable when he tests the teachers' students for dan grades. If I were in charge, I'd run it the same way. If that made me a dinosaur, I'd happily walk around like a T. Rex all day.

Agreed. I am more worried about my students. Most of them have been with me for over 15 years. Some for 20.

No I don't want to teach this way nor can I comply but again there is more at stake besides just me. I know about half of my personal student base would follow me. If I can get decent rates for insurance I'll be gone today. I am actually waiting to hear back from our associations agent.

As it stands the association pays for insurance out of our school and student dues and they get a really cheap rate. If they can match that for me it's not even a decision.

[MatsuShinshii]

Just received a call from the insurance company our association uses and they will extend the same coverage for the same cost to me and my students.

So basically I am an instructor without a home at this point because I have made up my mind to separate from my association.

I will talk with my students tonight and see what they think about this and which way they want to go. Hopefully I know them better than I did the rest of the student body.

[tubby]

The details aside, anyone who changes important details of motion (you must train kids) gets supoort to pass it without putting for open discussion and vote is a dangerous person to any committee.

Good luck with youbpath, whichever one you choose. Sounds like you have agood student base who understand and appreciate what you offer them

[JR 137]

I remember when my original sensei told us he was leaving his organization like it was yesterday. He said it was the most difficult MA thing he's ever done, yet objectively speaking it was a no-brainer.

We didn't see it coming when he did. The senior students were there for class, and before we started, he sat us down and told us. He didn't get into specifics other than it's been a long time coming, and he made the decision to withdraw when he felt he was no longer passionate about what he was teaching. He told us that he wouldn't hold any ill will against anyone who left and the door would always be open to them.

It was a pretty somber discussion. He asked if we had any questions or comments, and I was the only one to raise my hand. I said "you're my teacher, not them. I respect them, but I signed up in your dojo and not there's." Everyone else nodded in agreement. Not a single student left. The curriculum was far better after he went on his own.

Returning to the area after about 15 years, the only two dojos left are the co-founders' dojos. All 15 or so affiliated dojos left. That tells you something.

Edited January 26, 2017 by JR 137

[sensei8]

I remember when my original sensei told us he was leaving his organization like it was yesterday. He said it was the most difficult MA thing he's ever done, yet objectively speaking it was a no-brainer.

We didn't see it coming when he did. The senior students were there for class, and before we started, he sat us down and told us. He didn't get into specifics other than it's been a long time coming, and he made the decision to withdraw when he felt he was no longer passionate about what he was teaching. He told us that we wouldn't hold any ill will against anyone who left and the door would always be open to them.

It was a pretty somber discussion. He asked if we had any questions or comments, and I was the only one to raise my hand. I said "you're my teacher, not them. I respect them, but I signed up in your dojo and not there's." Everyone else nodded in agreement. Not a single student left. The curriculum was far better after he went on his own.

Returning to the area after about 15 years, the only two dojos left are the co-founders' dojos. All 15 or so affiliated dojos left. That tells you something.

Now that's a solid post, and man oh man, so familiar to me as some of it has that way to familiar ring.

[Spartacus Maximus]

If it can be of any consolation, dinosaurs are not only found in the upper levels of senior students. When political arguments and endless discussion about how and what should be taught become unbearably tedious, there really is only one choice and that is to leave.

If that is the only way to continue training or teaching the way one was taught, it is better to go on without a governing body, association or organization. One's instructor should take priority over whatever governing body and politics. After all, do we not learn from someone because of what they teach and how they teach or just because they belong to XYZ association?

So says the mighty Karate-saurus