That is not martial arts!

[Spartacus Maximus]

After visiting and observing most martial arts schools in my area, I realized that a majority of these seem to be heavily steeped in New Age or esoteric theory. The worst ones were almost cult-like in the way they taught and practised. The general impression is that the martial arts are some sort of marginal cult with weird rituals. Even acquaintances who were more or less familiar with martial arts seemed to think that.

The biggest issue with this and what was really shocking and disturbing to me, was the fact that I could not recognize what I saw as martial arts. Practicionners were way too preoccupied with whatever spiritual doctrine the school taught. The physical aspect and actual purpose to the movements was almost downplayed.

This is very strange and foreign to me and nothing like the martial arts I observed in Okinawa, Japan and China. Martial arts are a physical discipline and were never intended to be a belief system or religion. It seemed to surprise many that these two things (MA and spirituality/religion) are not the same and are mutually exclusive.

This made me rethink my plan to start teaching and served as proof that there is much work to do to restore the image of martial arts. The way it is taught and practised in that city probably makes many people very uncomfortable.

How common is this phenomenon in martial arts elsewhere? Any impressions or ideas to share? Has anyone ever had a similar experience?

[mushybees]

I've heard of a dojo in my area that insists on students washing their feet when they enter to cleanse themselves of inappropriate thoughts before training. Made me chuckle.

We don't go in for any spiritual/mystical nonsense in our club. We observe etiquette in our club, emphasise respect and consideration for each other and that's about it. We bow to each other, seiza at the end of class etc but no one is going to get chewed out for tying their belt wrong for instance.

[Lupin1]

I've visited a few clubs like that, as well. There's one here locally that teaches "Ninja" and seems very spiritual and cult-like. It separates the belts into things like "water stage" and "wind stage" and has a bunch of meditation and spiritual practices at each stage to help you be one with the elements and harness the power of ninja.

That stuff's fine if that's what you're looking for, but it personally makes me uncomfortable. Even the very normal, common stuff like bowing to black belts, calling people "Master", and having a shrine in the dojo make me uncomfortable at this point because we just don't do them. We have absolutely zero spiritual stuff and very little Asian cultural stuff at our school.

Not to say there isn't spiritual stuff in Isshinryu. For our black belt test, we have to memorize and formulate our own interpretations of Shimabuku's Code of Karate, which are eight very spiritual and esoteric statements, but we never discuss it in class and most people forget it shortly after the black belt test. It's not seen as important, but rather just part of the history of Isshinryu.

[Spartacus Maximus]

Following dojo traditions and protocol or martial philosophy is one thing and New Age mysticism, esoteric or spiritual belief systems are another.

While there is nothing wrong with any belief systems, it highly unethical and disturbing for anyone to teach martial arts as the expression and practice of these. It is a question of false representation and image. Perhaps the phenomenon is the product of over-enthusiastic instructors who are just following the popular interests. That however, does not and must not make it acceptable.

[Spartacus Maximus]

Nearly all of my training in Okinawan karate up to this point has been under native Okinawan instructors all of whom were very attached to the physical as well as philosophical aspects of the system they taught.

In all instances there was emphasis on martial philosophy(i.e. When it is morally acceptable to use what we train) but the main focus remained strictly functional techniques for skills in defense against attacks, strength and living a longer healthier life. Never was there any mention of a specific spiritual belief system.

There is severe digression from purpose when martial arts cease to be recognizable as such because they are taught in pursuit of a specific esoteric, spiritual or religious belief system. What I saw looked and felt foreign to me though not born and raised in East Asia. If I had been, I would have had rightly felt resentment.

A martial arts school is probably not the best place to go seek answers to issues related to one's personal spirituality. It is much more sensible to discuss this or esoteric practices with an expert on the topic. To expect a martial arts instructor to do that is ignorant and misguided.

[sensei8]

Solid OP, Spartacus Maximus!!

Of what you're speaking about is on every corner, like many major brands are today. All I do when I see/witness/read/etc about things like this, I shrug my shoulders and shake my head. But not in disbelieve! Why? It's so common placed now, anything for what we've all grown up to know as the MA is quite refreshing, yet, quite surprising.

How many times, in Pearland, TX, where I regretfully live at, have more "Karate" schools that the CI IS THE FOUNDER OF SAID STYLE. One, use to be a Power Ranger on TV, and he teaches what he's founded. Nothing wrong with that, except, it's riddled with what your OP spoke towards.

Practically all of these schools in Pearland, TX, no matter what the new fangled style might be, its core is TKD. Why can't they be proud of that. TKD is solid as the day is long, imho!!

Change is inevitable; granted! Nonetheless, change has to be needed. In my aforementioned paragraph right before this one, all of these are now...you guest it...10th Dan....GREAT....good reason for change, I suppose.

Appears to me that these schools have forgotten what the MA is, or smells like, or tastes like, or looks like, if they ever knew before. Rituals are built in their school, but then, imho, they want to separate themselves, and to do that, they've created a certain way to do anything, and anything that doesn't smell of the MA. Formalities and ceremonious events are part of the MA, but when you add 3 elephants, 12 tigers, 6 clowns, 3 rings, 7 jugglers, 2 trapeze artists, and 1 MC...then...you've just turned your MA school into a circus.

To each his/her own, I suppose!! Count me out of that...please!!

I'll just go back to my corner...and continue to shake my head in wonderment!!

Edited January 8, 2016 by sensei8

[JR 137]

People get upset about this stuff, and I understand why. I do too, but for a minute or so, then go about my business.

If you're the founder of your own art/style, you make the rules. Call yourself a 10th dan, master, guru, enlightened one, whatever you wish. You can have students sing Zippity Doo Dah while performing a form (I won't sully the name kata here) to be at one with their happy place. You can have students spar naked to spot their "tells" easier. You can have your students get drunk before self defense training so that they learn how to overcome the obstacles. It's your system, you make the rules. If people don't like it, they can leave; it's not like training there is a government mandated required.

If there's people out there who like this type of training and think you're a renaissance man/woman/god, so be it. People love to follow crack-pots. Everyone's got a void in their life, for lack of a better word, at some level that they're trying to fill. Some people take that to the extreme. If they're happy, party on.

All I can say is, do whatever it is that you've got to do. Just leave me and my family out of it. Don't try to sell me on your "way" (financially or not). If people want to think that's how the MA are in every dojo, nothing I can say to them is going to really change their mind anyway. And even if I could change their mind, what difference does it really make?

[Spartacus Maximus]

The fact that such schools exist is not any surprise and could be considered one of the stranger, more marginal aspects of the martial arts. What is worrisome is the situation where every school seems to have jumped on the New Age/Spiritual bandwagon. Perhaps it is just a passing fad or a "sign of the times".

[Montana]

I've also seen this sort of things in dojos across the nation. From budda statues in shrines, to crosses hanging on the wall.

I've been asked many times by people that they would love to take karate, but can't because they're Christians and won't pray to budda.

I laugh and tell them I teach karate, not religion.

Sparticus, who did you study under on Okinawa? Sensei Kuda by chance?

[Lupin1]

I've also seen this sort of things in dojos across the nation. From budda statues in shrines, to crosses hanging on the wall.

I've been asked many times by people that they would love to take karate, but can't because they're Christians and won't pray to budda

One of my instructor's instructors is a certified Protestant minister. I'm talking traditional US Southern Protestant (not sure which denomination). He has no problem training karate because we don't do it in a spiritual way, but when he's visited us I have heard him describe moves to the young beginners in terms of "God created man with a soft spot right here-- if you target that soft spot, it can help you defend yourself". I remember it because I thought it was odd in our New England secular dojo, but from what I remember about attending college down south, infusing religion into every day life is just what they do as part of the culture. It doesn't take people aback nearly as much as it does up here. Different cultures treat it differently.