JKA - Shotokan

[KaratePractitioner]

Hey guys just after a bit of information. I've been recently training in Uechi Ryu, but before that I did Koyru Uchinadi (before I realised I was wasting my money) but I have now moved onto Shotokan under the Japanese Karate Association. Can anyone tell me a little bit about the style? Is it effective? Is it a good style to get into? The sensei that teaches it is 6th Dan so no doubt he knows what he's talking about, I just don't know much about the style, so personal input with experience in JKA would be great. Cheers!

[JR 137]

Why was Koryu Uchinadi a waste of money? Patrick McCarthy's Koryu Uchinadi?

Did did you leave Uechi Ryu?

What will JKA Shotokan give you that was missing from the others?

Forget about styles, rank, credentials, etc. The most important thing is the teacher's teaching style. Different dojos within the same style will be very different from each other. I study Seido Juku. Some dojos are full of adults who go heavy on contact. Some are full of kids point fighting. If all I saw was the kids point fighting, I'd think it was a waste of money for me personally. It would be pretty stupid to say the entire art is what one dojo is.

I'm not saying you don't know what you want, but everyone should have a solid idea of what they're looking for, then visit as many schools as possible in order to find a place that's in line with their expectations.

[Maybetrue]

"Dan" are watered down already.

for people that are young and starting out , a sandan or yondan in his 30-40's year olds are the best to learn from, they basically still at peak condition and dont worry about anything else but training.

for someone that is a black belt and need to learn Karate-DO. you need to find a higher rank with experience in all aspects of Martial arts.

Most "6th dan" are just average karateka that put their time in and follow what the 'Head" figure said for decades or people that just jump around organizations trying to collect "dans".

Odds are 90 to 10 ratio(might even be 95 to 5)

90 average 6th dans

10 Really good 6th dans.

The more the instructor has to talk about the ORGANIZATION and DAN, the more likely he is one of the 90 average.

Just train hard if your a beginner. even a good technician brown belt can teach good karate.

[GojuRyu Bahrain]

My personal story led me away from JKA (I have a 2nd Dan with them):

1- too much Politics (three clubs I trained in had constant fights and bickering among instructors, leading to the splitting of two clubs),

2- they teach pure sport Karate (that I consider 'fake' compared to more Okinawan self defense systems),

3- ineffective training (most of it seems to be filtering out talented people instead of building skills..leading to a lot of older JKA Karatekas quitting because of wrecked knees and damaged hips...

I have trained Uechi Ryu (attained ni Kyu before I moved away) and loved it.

But, as JR wrote a lot depends on who is teaching and what your goals are.

[DaveB]

There's no such thing as an effective style, only effective training. Your goals and how they match up to the specific school are all that matters.

Try it out and tell us what it's like and what your goals areand maybe more insight can be given.

In general though JKA karateka have very solid and powerful technique and a good grasp of the basics of combat. It is an excellent foundation for most martial arts goals.

[sensei8]

"Dan" are watered down already.

for people that are young and starting out , a sandan or yondan in his 30-40's year olds are the best to learn from, they basically still at peak condition and dont worry about anything else but training.

for someone that is a black belt and need to learn Karate-DO. you need to find a higher rank with experience in all aspects of Martial arts.

Most "6th dan" are just average karateka that put their time in and follow what the 'Head" figure said for decades or people that just jump around organizations trying to collect "dans".

Odds are 90 to 10 ratio(might even be 95 to 5)

90 average 6th dans

10 Really good 6th dans.

The more the instructor has to talk about the ORGANIZATION and DAN, the more likely he is one of the 90 average.

Just train hard if your a beginner. even a good technician brown belt can teach good karate.

Solid post!!

As a Senior Dan, it can be a hard pill to swallow, what Maybetrue is stating, because I feel that I'm lumped in with them, the 90 average, undeservingly so by association. Unless you've shared the floor with me, I can imagine that everyone here thinks that of me from time to time, if not all of the time because we've not shared the floor; proof is on the floor!!

I believe in my heart that I'm of the 10 percent stated because of my work ethic on and off the floor! I share our Hombu inside and outside with everyone here at KF, so I suppose there's that 90 percent. However, I'm the elected Kaicho of our Hombu/SKKA, albeit, a representative at large. I speak about Dan less and less, yet, I'll post my believes and opinions, good and bad, without reservations. I don't want students that are chasing for the Dan rank; I've no time nor inclinations to do so!!

I've seen with my own eyes and I've heard with my own ears, exactly what Maybetrue is speaking towards in this thread concerning Senior Dans, and it makes me sick to my stomach whenever I witness it first hand. At times, it has reared its ugly head in our Hombu/SKKA, and it has sickened me to the core, and my anger is not easily quenched whenever it happens in-house.

[wildbourgman]

JKA Shotokan is a very athletic style with linear movement initially, they do teach tai sabaki in the higher ranks. The concept that Shotokan has that's different than other styles I've seen is using a strong direct one strike to end a fight. They do use combinations but it's normally to help enter or disguise the ultimate game ender.

Shotokan is very good for people who want vigorous exercise, learning and perfecting strong strikes, and enjoying sport karate.

I personally don't think that Shotokan is a very good style to grow old with because it depends on speed and power to be very effective. Much to my surprise I've even heard a Japanese 9th dan (one of the few in JKA) make something close to that very point at a camp.

I love Shotokan and still train in it but I can see as I get older my effectiveness will come from being wise, calm, and using timing rather than trying to out speed and out muscle a 25 year old.

So ask yourself what am I looking for? Are you looking for exercise? Are you looking for strong powerful striking practice? Are you looking for to go to tournaments and compete? If so Shotokan is right for you.

[bush352]

My personal story led me away from JKA (I have a 2nd Dan with them):

1- too much Politics (three clubs I trained in had constant fights and bickering among instructors, leading to the splitting of two clubs),

2- they teach pure sport Karate (that I consider 'fake' compared to more Okinawan self defense systems),

3- ineffective training (most of it seems to be filtering out talented people instead of building skills..leading to a lot of older JKA Karatekas quitting because of wrecked knees and damaged hips...

I have trained Uechi Ryu (attained ni Kyu before I moved away) and loved it.

But, as JR wrote a lot depends on who is teaching and what your goals are.

[bushido_man96]

There's no such thing as an effective style, only effective training. Your goals and how they match up to the specific school are all that matters.

This is probably the best I've heard it said. And its so true. Good advise!

[sensei8]

There's no such thing as an effective style, only effective training. Your goals and how they match up to the specific school are all that matters.

This is probably the best I've heard it said. And its so true. Good advise!

I disagree!

Imho, in which I've stood behind for so many years...

The style's effective, yet the practitioner isn't effective. Who's fault is that? Not the style, but the practitioner!! The practitioner isn't perfect, neither is the style. However, the methodology as well as the ideology IS effective. For example, the front kick is effective...the reverse punch is effective...the block/deflection is effective...HOWEVER, the practitioner makes the technique(s) ineffective by the practitioners designed interpretation of HOW said technique(s) must and should be executed effectively.

Saying the Sun isn't effective, for a crude and bad example, isn't the fault of the Sun, but the people who live on Earth as to how the Sun must be and should be used effectively; misinterpretations are abound.

Shindokan, biased plug here, sorry, is effective. Soke has create an effective style of the MA based on his knowledge. He's solid methodologies and ideologies, in which he's crafted a solid curriculum/syllabus. Now, mix in some students, and there we go, INTERPRETATIONS of Soke's creation, Shindokan Saitou-ryu, can, and has run awry on its own because of those interpretations.

And when that happens, misinterpretations, it's of no wonder why so many of us have failed at Testing Cycles right in front of him!!

Again, imho!!