Strikers mind vs Grapplers mind

[Judodad_karateson]

I've been thinking about this a little lately, but there seems to be a subte different between grappling and striking I just can't put my finger on. I've done judo in the past, still a judoka at heart, but I've been taken karate lately. We both wear gis, bow and the same time, use the same langauge, similar terminology, both from the same country of origin, but the mind set/personality/attitude just seems different in my Karate school as my Judo school.

Maybe it was just my schools, may it is the age gap between when I did judo, and now, but has anyone else noticed a mental different between Artists who prefer to focus on grappling and those who prefer striking?

[Wastelander]

I've been thinking about this a little lately, but there seems to be a subte different between grappling and striking I just can't put my finger on. I've done judo in the past, still a judoka at heart, but I've been taken karate lately. We both wear gis, bow and the same time, use the same langauge, similar terminology, both from the same country of origin, but the mind set/personality/attitude just seems different in my Karate school as my Judo school.

Maybe it was just my schools, may it is the age gap between when I did judo, and now, but has anyone else noticed a mental different between Artists who prefer to focus on grappling and those who prefer striking?

Well, there are many "minds" in grappling arts and in striking arts, so it's hard to say. Generally, grapplers wants to get in close, and strikers want to stay at a distance, so that can be pretty widely applied to your subject.

For more specifics, you really have to consider how each school approaches their art. For example, I studied judo in two different dojo, and the mindset was quite different in each place, despite teaching the same art! Likewise, I've studied karate in two different styles/dojo, and visited many more, and the mindset is vastly different between all of them.

For example, my first judo dojo taught very formal, precise judo--the kind you see in the demo videos from the first half of the 20th Century. They also spent every other class working newaza (groundwork). In my second judo dojo, they taught very dynamic, Olympic judo, with an emphasis on winning competitions, and in 2 years I was there for two classes where they did newaza practice. While both required you to get in close, and the emphasis was on throwing your opponent, after that the mindsets were totally different!

At my first karate dojo, I developed strong basics and body mechanics, and learned to do long-range point sparring. At my current dojo, I've learned to explore the kata for practical self defense and fighting techniques, and I've learned how to apply karate up close and personal, and deal with an ugly fight. Those are two very different worlds.

[Luther unleashed]

As wastelander pointed out, grapplers like to get close and strikers don't. In what I teach as a striker, there is a "green zone" a "red zone" and a "yellow zone"! For a grappler there the opposite or maybe even 2 "green zones". Let me explain as to me this is the major difference from a technical standpoint.

Striking Arts

•Green Zone - You are too far away to be harmed and therefore your safe.

•Red Zone - you are right in the striking area, can be reached by strikes and can't directly grab your opponent.

•Yellow Zone - you are close enough to grab and use close quarter striking/throws/basic grappling. Although not the green zone, your safer then in between which is the primary striking range.

Grappling Arts

•Green Zone - you are too far away to be harmed therefore you are safe.

•Red Zone - you are right in the striking area, can be reached by strikes and can't directly grab your opponent.

•Green Zone - here a grappler is safe, and can presumably feel right at home. They can control their opponent and protect themselves. Especially an untrained fighter is less of a threat because close quarter strikes are much less powerful in this zone.

I always teach students that the green zone "safest place" is where somebody can't reach you, again, a grappler may not agree. Mentally I find this to be the most significant difference in mental approach or "game" if you will.

[tallgeese]

A lot of it goes to connection.

In striking arts, people are always wanting to stay away from building connection. This makes it easier to control range.

In grappling arts, it's the opposite. Grapplers will do whatever they can to build any kind of connection.

Part of this is range, some of it is grips, but really it's about owning anatomical waypoints on the body and manipulating the other's base from there. This connection not only allows for control but also for sensitivity to the other persons intent via reading the shift in body mass.

Proper connection is critical in good grappling. Keeping a grappler from building it is critical to the striker.

[muttley]

Having trained in karate for most of my martial arts life but also having dabbled in Aikido and Judo in my time, I am now studying at a class where the sensei likes to incorporate some judo/grappling techniques into the lessons.

I am really enjoying this and finding it very beneficial to my training, it is helping me to understand the complexities of grappling and "finding" an opening from striking to grappling etc.

I am not saying that this bit of grappling/judo training input in my karate class is going to make me an expert but it has definitely opened my eyes to where grappling can be used in karate and I believe is making me far more confident in my overall confidence in dealing with matters.

[sensei8]

The mental mindset decides that which is comfortable, and comfortable is being safe. Shindokan is 85% hands, hence I suppose that we're strikers, but were strikers who can grapple too. I completely understand distancing and all, but for the love of me I just don't understand why strikers feel safe when they're distancing themselves. Can't be effective, and can't hit any target while keeping distance from the attacker...GET CLOSE and work!!

Fear affects the mindset because it wants to be comfortable. I'm not saying that one should just mindlessly wander in in an haphazard fashion, but one can't swim unless they're willing to wade into some water.

Both the striker and the grappler are quite calculative. yet, almost to a fault when distancing in concerned. There's a time to know and there's a time to show; but uncertainty and over confidence can go hand in hand.

Being safe can hinder productivity while trying to be proactive.

[Judodad_karateson]

A lot of it goes to connection.

In striking arts, people are always wanting to stay away from building connection. This makes it easier to control range.

In grappling arts, it's the opposite. Grapplers will do whatever they can to build any kind of connection.

Part of this is range, some of it is grips, but really it's about owning anatomical waypoints on the body and manipulating the other's base from there. This connection not only allows for control but also for sensitivity to the other persons intent via reading the shift in body mass.

Proper connection is critical in good grappling. Keeping a grappler from building it is critical to the striker.

The mental mindset decides that which is comfortable, and comfortable is being safe.

Maybe that is what I'm seeing. It's about being comfortable in someone personal space, and having someone in yours. Judo was so personal. First day of class, you're getting in someone face, not just in rondori, but just to practice technique. Class was stretch, break falls, then close personal contact for the next hour or so. From day one, you're hands are all over someone else, yanking their gi around, rolling on the floor, throwing them. In Karate, you don't need any contact at all to start out, the Basics, the Kata, the one step is probably the most contact a white belt is getting if they aren't sparring much.

[Wado Heretic]

Leverage and Timing will always be the answer to speed and strength. This is generally true for both striking and grappling; however, how it is expressed is different. A striker will understand those terms in a manner of angles and pacing, where as a grappler might better comprehend the concepts in the context of position and reacting to proprioception.

However, even then there are further differences. Boxers versus kick-boxers for example both employ different maai, despite both being primarily striking arts.

Wrestlers and Judoka also differ, in wrestling someone is usually in your face constantly where as Judoka generally gain a grip or work grip fighting. Furthermore, Judoka generally favour pulling guard in newaza, compared to working from the top like wrestlers.

The big difference, I would say is only noticeable between full-contact participants. I find that people who have to hit each other, are slightly more competitive, that they naturally focus somewhat more on their opponent; the opponent is a target. In contrast, I find grapplers tend to be more laid back the more experienced they are, though they still enjoy competing, they do not quite have a certain ruthlessness.

However, to concur with the others; it comes down to the rule of if you can cut, you can be cut to. People develop their attitudes and strategy dependent on where they can "cut" from. Strikers try to head-hunt because that is the most fundamental tactic, where as grapplers will tend to offer their head more to find their opportunity.

[CTTKDKing]

Another thing to consider is that grapplers tend to favor a one on one concepts. Not saying this is the case for all of them but, I know in our karate class we spend a good deal of time practicing "mass attack" concepts in our karate with very little, if any, sport applications. We also practice one on one defense scenarios but even our defense techniques that involve grappling in a one on one scenario, the instructors are quick to remind you that you need to disable your opponent quickly because it's likely that your opponents buddies are coming in quickly to stab, punch, kick you in the back.

[Luther unleashed]

Another thing to consider is that grapplers tend to favor a one on one concepts. Not saying this is the case for all of them but, I know in our karate class we spend a good deal of time practicing "mass attack" concepts in our karate with very little, if any, sport applications. We also practice one on one defense scenarios but even our defense techniques that involve grappling in a one on one scenario, the instructors are quick to remind you that you need to disable your opponent quickly because it's likely that your opponents buddies are coming in quickly to stab, punch, kick you in the back.

Good point, this is a really good point. Although, it's my personal feeling as a teacher that mass attack situations are better won by running or not getting into them. I teach knife and gun self defense at higher ranks, but I'm always very clear this is only desired If you have nowhere to run.

As a quick note, the main thing I see as effective for this is to line opponents up, and defend against one at a time. We do double team sparring and this is the main thing I tell them, put your opponents in a line.