The Propensity Of Violence!!

[sensei8]

Yesterday, my wife, our son, and I went over to one of my nieces house for the purpose of having a belated birthday get-together with many relatives in attendance over barbeque and socializing for my wife; it was her idea, and one that I fully supported.

The event started out in normal tones with the usual salutations of greeting each and everyone with "hello" and many handshakes, as men do, and hugs/kisses, as women do. Many kids were there as well, and they were not saved from any hugs/kisses, and the occasional cheek twisting or back-slaps. After all, we're family through and through to the bone!!

And as things at barbeque gatherings settle, the women huddle either in the kitchen and/or the backyard deck, while the men huddle around some sporting activity and/or the BBQ grill. The kids, well, they're everywhere playing as kids do play.

We had our huge fare of meats on the grills, and we had our share of alcoholic beverages as well as non-alcoholic [soda/tea/lemonade/water] beverages. The music was blaring...having a good time with family.

I don't drink any alcoholic of any sort; it's not my thing, not now and not ever!! I don't judge those who do drink alcohol, it's their choice, and their adults, and we've a few family members that don't know how to exercise a modicum of restraint/control on drinking. And, we're at someone else's home and I don't make the rules of their home. At my home, NO ONE'S allowed to indulge in any alcoholic beverages EVER!!

About two and half hours in, one of my nieces' husbands starts getting quite loud and abrasive in his language, and yes, events like this give him an excuse to drink heavy. Other than that, he's a social drinker. The home we're visiting and gathering together at is his home. He's the host, he's the BBQ cook [he's some mad skills in that area], and up until now, he was quite affable in his demeanor.

One thing lead to another thing, and the violence erupted with the aforementioned husband of one of my niece's is in the core of it all. His anger is aimed at his wife, one my niece's and this one husband has a history of domestic violence. He's currently attending meetings to address his domestic violence; and, until now, he's been a pillar of change.

Several members, including myself, intervene quickly to squash his supposed intent; he was in his wife's face, spewing colorful metaphors at her, and the veins in his neck were bulging: he was ANGRY!! My niece kowtowed quickly in retreat to save herself from him, and what he might still do!

Our interventions only outraged him the more, but with me at the front, he knew he'd better cool down and back off NOW!! He retreated back inside of the house, and this gave us the moment to try to figure what just occurred. The once fun atmosphere was replaced with an unsettling tension and fear; I sensed that this wasn't going to just go away with his retreat.

I was right!!

He came out from inside the house towards where my niece was with a vengeance of intent. I put myself back between my niece and her husband. The only way I knew to deescalate the moment was to be that force that would keep him at bay, and if my presence was enough to cause him to pause and rethink, then I'm pleased to know that he wasn't without his complete faculties to decide that going through me wouldn't be good for him.

He glared at me, and that's all he could do, and he knew it, and then stormed away, but this time to his car, then speed away.

It was at this time, I told my wife and my son that we're leaving, and we're leaving now!! So, we left the party!

Upon arriving at home, his started getting a volley of phone calls from several family members asking me why we left...why we didn't stay...and so on and so forth. Other husbands/boyfriends were STILL at the party, and these other men can protect their families/girlfriends/kids/etc.

WAIT A MINUTE!!

My job is to protect my family, and I did just that. My immediate concern, whether my family likes it or not, is to protect my wife...my son...my daughter...THAT'S IT!! By me deciding that we are leaving, is my way of defending THEM above all!! Separate them from what had just occurred as soon as possible. I don't apologize for it, and I won't apologize for protecting my wife and son!! It's my way, and my family knows this, and the other family members know this of me as well. It's no surprise.

In my opinion, the propensity of violence still remained, and while the husband might've left, he will return soon enough, and my family and I weren't going to be there when he decided to come home.

I've lost many close friends because I've chosen to leave their "parties", and take my family with me without any formalities at all because I believed that the propensity of violence still remained. The friends I've lost because of my chosen actions to vacate surprised me, because I warned them all about what I would do if violence of any degree erupted...they understood, but forgot, or didn't think I was serious. I didn't apologize to them either; I did what I felt was right to protect my family.

If my actions are wrong, then, by God, I'll remain wrong, but unapologetic for protecting my family the way I see fit. My family is mine to protect...that's what I did!!

The party, I hear, calmed down and finished without anymore outbursts, and that's because he never returned last night; slept it off at one of his relatives houses. All left the party happy and full and content!

I will not visit my nieces home ever because I believe that as long as her husband is there, the propensity of violence still remains a possibility. One of my relatives asked me if I was afraid of him? Is that why I won't go back to their house? OH PLEASE!! I reminded that relative that I'm not afraid of anyone, especially him...and that relative knows that, and so does my niece's husband!!

I won't put my family in harms way by returning to their home...EVER!!

[cathal]

For some reason a drunk man was permitted to drive away thus the chance for him to return recklessly was still around. Rather than speculate about how the situation could've become worse I'll say that I really do not blame you for acting to protect your family.

Removing yourself from the potential of violence is just as important as knowing how to defend yourself from a punch.

[Spartacus Maximus]

Avoiding violence whenever it is feasible is always the best solution. There is no merit to remaining in a place or situation where one's well being is compromised. I would hesitate to call anyone who fails to understand that my friend.

There was only one right choice in the situation and Sensei8 did that. The drunk man was incredibly lucky not to get into more trouble. Getting into a car and driving intoxicated could have cost him a lot more.

Usually when a person has little or no control of emotions and tends to act on impulse, it becomes the centre or that person's character. The more attempts made to repress it or hide it are made, the more likely it is to surface. Intoxication just makes the deeper issues worse and it seems that the man in question has many more serious issues that ought to be dealt with. Sobering up will help but it will not change him.

[Montana]

Excuse me for pointing this out, but your neice is also "your family", and from the sounds of it, you were the only reason her husband didn't attack her...and you left?

Myself, I would have told my wife and kids to take the car and leave, and stayed at the party and either had my wife come get me later when things calmed down, or caught a ride with somebody else.

I agree that your own personal familys safety is most important, but isn't your neices also? It didn't sound like any of the other men were of much help.

That's just the way I'd have done it I guess..but I have a bad case sometimes of White Knight Syndrome.

[jaypo]

I'd say you did the right thing. Imagine if you had stayed, the guy came back even angrier, and you had to take some action. You'd probably have to do something that you wouldn't want to do, and I'm sure the reactions you're getting would have been far worse than what you're seeing now. And nowadays, especially dealing with someone with documented anger issues, who's to say that he won't come back with a weapon. I know the age old adage is that you pop a bully in the mouth, and he leaves you alone. But this was a man with anger issues, intoxicated, and not thinking/acting rationally. He may try to meet the threat with greater force, and since he knows you're able to take him hand to hand, he may stack the deck against you. So you'd be put in a situation where you'd have to defend against a weapon, and if you're like me, my course of action is determined by the threat in front of me!

I've been in a few situations where me walking away left me open to a lot of scorn. However, by doing so, I probably saved a lot of people a lot of pain, myself included! I am not very fond of getting sued, so I find it a little easier to deal with people talking than with people taking away the things I've worked so hard to obtain in my life!

[Spartacus Maximus]

The only thing I would have added would have been to call the police especially once the drunken man decided to take the car. Sometimes it can be very difficult to protect everyone.

Afterall this is different from a regular angry drunk situation because everyone involved is family and the problem individual is at home. Nothing is as morally and emotionally taxing as trying to do something for someone who will not or cannot understand that it is for their own good.

A moment of bitterness and anger from family or friends for a just action is better than a lifetime of grief and sadness because of inaction.

[sensei8]

There were 8 other men still there; 2 are bouncers, 3 are construction workers, 1 a truck driver, 1 an executive, and 1 a CEO, and none of them are small men...4 of them are taller than me, and I'm 6'1". I believed then, and I still believe now, that my niece was well protected. Had that not been so, I would've stayed and got a ride home much later. That's me!!

All of these men came to back me up when the anger drunk husband was stopped/confronted by myself. And of course, everyone, including the drunk husband knows my MA background quite well. I was only able to position myself so quickly because of where I was standing and where the argument escalated...3-4 steps to my left. The other men were standing around the BBQ, which was over 50 feet away straight ahead of me.

As far as the drunk husband driving away, well, we tried to stop him, but before we could do truly anything about it, he was peeling out. His car keys were in his pocket, and his car wasn't blocked in. My sister called the police and gave info, including license plate number and car and husband description. Our niece didn't want us to make an official report, and had my sister refuse a patrol car to come to the house.

The "why'd you leave?" verbal attacks was more because I left the party, and not what had just occurred. And, these came from the women, not the men!!

[Spartacus Maximus]

I believe that most people are reasonable once they realize that something was done for a sensible reason. Leaving was probably the right thing to do, especially if the drunken incident made the party no longer enjoyable. if people still think ill of you for removing yourself and your family from an unpleasant atmosphere, they have the problem. It is perfectly acceptable and understandable to leave when a party no longer feels like a party. More so if said party is suddenly disrupted by one or two fools unable to control themselves and their indulgment

[Montana]

There were 8 other men still there; 2 are bouncers, 3 are construction workers, 1 a truck driver, 1 an executive, and 1 a CEO, and none of them are small men...4 of them are taller than me, and I'm 6'1". I believed then, and I still believe now, that my niece was well protected. Had that not been so, I would've stayed and got a ride home much later. That's me!!

All of these men came to back me up when the anger drunk husband was stopped/confronted by myself. And of course, everyone, including the drunk husband knows my MA background quite well. I was only able to position myself so quickly because of where I was standing and where the argument escalated...3-4 steps to my left. The other men were standing around the BBQ, which was over 50 feet away straight ahead of me.

As far as the drunk husband driving away, well, we tried to stop him, but before we could do truly anything about it, he was peeling out. His car keys were in his pocket, and his car wasn't blocked in. My sister called the police and gave info, including license plate number and car and husband description. Our niece didn't want us to make an official report, and had my sister refuse a patrol car to come to the house.

The "why'd you leave?" verbal attacks was more because I left the party, and not what had just occurred. And, these came from the women, not the men!!

Well, OK then...with that added info I can understand why you left. Your initial post made it seem like nobody else was getting involved in the situation.

[sensei8]

While I appreciate your support, I made this topic to speak towards how to deescalate a situation similar to mine.

What, if you were in my shoes that day, what would you have done differently to deescalate him/the situation??

Deescalate skills are, imho, an overlooked portion of the MA. We learn how to defend ourselves and others, but we don't adequately address how to deescalate. The answer isn't always found in our hands and feet, if you get my drift.

I deescalated him by not being that MA force. Yes, I stood between him and his wife, but, I stayed calm while he was loud and threatening. At every threat spewed from his mouth, I simply said..."No!"..."Relax!"..."Please calm down!"..."I understand!"..."Please, lets, you and I sit down for a minute, first!"...things like that, but my voice remained calm and low and reassuring.

Yeah, I made myself as big as I could. Which wasn't a stretch, but I believe you understand what I'm saying. My stance, however it was, was ready! My hands, however I held them, were unthreatening! My demeanor, however it was construed, was calm!

Was I ready to unleash hell on him, if need be? Yes! But, in reality, he wasn't a threat to me, and I always side to deescalate the situation at all measures before physicality is necessary. He was a threat to others at the party, but what also helped to deescalate the matter was it was him versus 9 determined men set to protect whomever; 9 vs 1 speaks in volumes. The other men said nothing to disturb what I was slowly deescalating. Any other added voice to mine might've undermined any advantage or any reasoning from reaching him. But until the other men got beside me, it was me and him, alone, one on one, and I chose to deescalate him, and would've have continued to do so until physicality was necessary.

Back to the bold type above...I await your answer, and allow us to discuss de-escalation ideas together!!