Can the average person earn a black belt?

[Harkon72]

More to the point unfortunately these days; "How much does the average person need to pay to earn their black belt?" Everything seems to have a price. Insurance your child doesn't need - £20 a year. Tuition - £50 a month. Grading by your own instructor £30 a quarter. Non recognised black belt grading for a 10 year old - £100. These figures are typical. Okinawan Masters were humble people, Karate for some is no longer an art, it's money for old rope. Thoughts?

[Lupin1]

I think anyone could earn a black belt if they were willing to put in the time and effort. It doesn't take some pre-ordained skill or attribute-- just time and perseverance.

As for the Okinawan masters not selling their karate... I can't say much considering the founder of my style taught karate to enemy soldiers during WWII to avoid being prosecuted by them for draft dodging and then taught US soldiers afterwards for $250 a month-- an arrangement that many of his fellow Okinawans were not too happy with and which lost him many of his Okinawan students (whom he had taught for free).

[Harkon72]

That's interesting, my original teacher taught me for free, I only paid for my gradings, and that was not to him. He was on a ship in the Far East and his teacher was Okinawan. What he paid him, I do not know; but he returned safe and well from some of the toughest ports in the world.

[Spartacus Maximus]

This is indeed a very difficult question to answer because it is subject to so many interpretations. A black belt is not meant to be a commodity or a material product to be bought. Any cost value given for obtaining a black belt grade is as arbitrary as the set of skills the student should have acquired for that rank.

A black belt can cost anything or nothing. The only price that matters is how much it cost in effort, practise and training. That said, anyone can buy a black belt rank. Some pay a little, some pay through the nose but not everyone has the patience and dedication to earn it. The fact that the higher the cost the less depth there is in content is also very telling.

[mal103]

I've just worked it out for my Club, for about 3 years training, joining fee, insurance and gradings it will cost about £900 ($1400)

I did an alternative costing on another club and got £1300 but I suspect that there are several more that charge more.

A student commented the other day that Karate was his cheapest ever hobby so it depends on what we are willing to pay. You can see how lots of clubs can get swayed by greed, normally this effects the training as they have too many students of give up their training to teach and then gain bad habits. Personally I only ever want to cover my costs and will offer extra free training if funds get too high, or reduce regular costs.

When you compare it to other life expenses over 3 years then it can be fairly cheap, for example my fuel bill for my motorbike is £7000 for 3 years, to buy my favourite blend of tea costs me over £500 for 3 years. I'm not going to work out my alcohol bill though....

[RAM18]

Paying to learn is not a new thing.

We pay to learn to drive. we pay to learn at higher education and evening classes. People pay for Art classes which is even more subjective than martial arts!

If you apply hardwork and do something long enough then you can be rewarded with such things as a black belt. The trouble is these days is we don't train in paddy fields from Okinawan masters.

My school has a dojo in a top sports facility offers Karate and BJJ a karate cardio class and a Cage Fitness class with well maintained equipment. We are expected to apply ourselves to our skills and fitness and progress. This is something I am happy to pay for!

[Lupin1]

As RAM said, how does the price of martial arts compare to other sports/athletic programs? How many hundreds of dollars do parents pay for their kids to go to basketball or baseball clinics? Our local gymnastics school charges $175 for ten lessons. I paid over $1000 one summer in college for private tennis lessons once a week. The average pilates class around here is $15 per session and there are upwards of 30 people in a class.

Of course I don't agree with price gouging-- with selling belts people don't deserve just to get their money or charging exorbitant testing fees without a reason (if they're flying a master in from somewhere else and putting him up in a hotel for a black belt test, a high price makes sense). But even $100 a month seems to be the norm around here for any twice a week athletic instruction/session, not just martial arts.

[Canadian77]

I see the point of paying for a black belt giving it less weight. However, in paying for my karate I certainly don't see it in that light. My sensei does this for his livelihood. He has to live, and he certainly isn't making a profit of every cent we students pay. There is the space to pay for, the equipment, etc. Still, a lot of the money goes in his pocket, as well it should. He gives more time to his students than most people give to their work in a regular work-week. He teaches the majority of each and every class, right down to the new young novices. He gives his wisdom, his knowledge, and works hard. And I have worked hard to acquire the small bit of skill in this art that I have gained so far. The various belts I have earned are a nice reminder that I am slowly improving and fine-tuning my skill, the many belts ahead, and time it takes to earn them, is a reminder of how far I still have to go. I don't think it's fair to the effort I put in, or the effort my sensei puts in, to say that the money I spend to train is me buying a black belt.

I think that there are clubs where the emphasis may be more on the money and less on the actual hard work. But our sensei is always assessing students, and will not put them up for grading if he doesn't feel they are ready. There are so many other reasons why I don't see our belts as earned with money. Perhaps if he were a simple man in Okinawa who could be fed by the villagers and bathe in a river he would not need to charge. But he is a man with a family living in the suburbs, so the fact that he needs to earn money at this is reasonable. His heart is 100% into teaching karate, he obviously does it because he loves it, and that love for the art comes through and is passed on to his students.

So, I can count up the money I have spent at the dojo, but that is the use of the space and equipment, the time and energy of the instructors, etc. For me, the belts themselves were only earned with hard work, sweat, a few tears, and the joy of the art.

[Wastelander]

I think that there is often a tendency for traditional martial artists to believe that martial arts are sacred, in some way, and that no one should make a living by teaching them. I'm not sure where this idea comes from--as far as I know, masters all over Okinawa, Japan, and China required some form of payment for training. Sometimes it was simply payment in the form of dedication, yes, but more often it was money or food. Paying your instructor a fee for his/her time and the use of the dojo is perfectly reasonable.

That said, there are certainly instructors out there who price gouge, up-charge, and add fees just to make more money. That is how capitalism works, so they are free to do it, but I don't like it. Making a living is one thing, but gaming the system is another.

[AdamKralic]

I loathe the idea that one is obligated to give without requiring something in return. Effort is not payment enough. Effort does not pay mortgages. Effort does not feed families.

If you feel that a martial artist or any human being for that matter do not deserve payment for their knowledge/effort...you believe them to be a slave.

I am a art director by trade. I cannot possibly tell you how many times family and friends have hit me up for a logo or a website or to doctor a photograph for them. Because it is art based I am supposed to do it for the love of the art I assume?

It's insulting...and yet I have done it several times for family....because they are family. Still was insulted all the same though.

You get what you pay for. Pay for nothing..you deserve...nothing.