Bassai Dai (Shotokan version) question.

[GaryMo]

I have to say, I only see the soto uki, uchi uki then onto the sweeping catch then soto uki.

[wildbourgman]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gG5JScqpdtg/TOLNloyHOOI/AAAAAAAAAR8/x2qmfyxCGBE/s1600/Bassai+Dai.jpg

I don't know if this will work, but on this diagram I'm watching right hand placement between move 4 and 5. Gary it's very fast I wish I knew how to run you tube in slow motion.

[andym]

Don't confuse yourself with all the variations on 'You Tube'. Stick to the one your sensei teaching. The kata of Shotokan were once very uniform. With the fall of the JKA, from the central authority of Shotokan, a great many subtle changes have taken place to kata, within different groups.

[wildbourgman]

I understand andyn and I don't worry about the variances of the different katas on youtube. What did kind of concern me was the fact that I don't want to re-learn something for a rank test and have my muscle memory fight me because of years of practing this kata one way. So it wasn't just any youtube variation on any old kata, it was this particular video it was a specific organization attach to the video and also this specific kata.

I've seen various Karate Federations make official changes to katas and techniques and I thought that maybe I was seeing one on that clip. After a little more research and discussion I'm not as concerned as I was when I created this thread.

Thanks!

[Shizentai]

Sorry for the confusion about which technique you were referring to. I don't think that is not an outright downward block, so much as an across-the-body cover and preparation before doing uchi uke (forearm block from the inside going out). Here is a video of another karate style where they emphasize this heavily. Imagine if you will a quick abbreviated version of this:

I trained in Mikami sensei's dojo in New Orleans for over a decade. This quick right-hand-coming-across-to-cover is how I learned bassai dai while a brown belt training there. Although many minor things are slightly different between kata in Japanese JKA and in our group, this one I believe is the same.

Anyway, it sounds like you've already made peace with this technique, but I hope that was at least somewhat informative.

Will you be testing under Mikami sensei's group or another? Maybe I'll run into you at summer training camp this June? Perhaps nationals come this Fall? I'm trying to get up the courage to test for judging & instructor then as well.

[wildbourgman]

I hope to test under Mr. Mikami before he retires. All of my other certificates have his signature it would be really nice to get another one 25 years later.

One of my problems is I work in the oilfield so my training is either alone or sporatic in a dojo. I'm trainging Shoring ryu with one or two classes a month of Shotokan. I hope the technique variations within Shorin Ryu don't affect me testing in Shotokan.

[sensei8]

Don't confuse yourself with all the variations on 'You Tube'. Stick to the one your sensei teaching. The kata of Shotokan were once very uniform. With the fall of the JKA, from the central authority of Shotokan, a great many subtle changes have taken place to kata, within different groups.

Solid post!!

[sensei8]

I understand andyn and I don't worry about the variances of the different katas on youtube. What did kind of concern me was the fact that I don't want to re-learn something for a rank test and have my muscle memory fight me because of years of practing this kata one way. So it wasn't just any youtube variation on any old kata, it was this particular video it was a specific organization attach to the video and also this specific kata.

I've seen various Karate Federations make official changes to katas and techniques and I thought that maybe I was seeing one on that clip. After a little more research and discussion I'm not as concerned as I was when I created this thread.

Thanks!

Solid post, as well!!

[andym]

As to changes to kata, solely for what I can only describe as 'political' reasons. It's one of the bains of my life...All styles of Karate do it, no matter what they say ! Worst example I've encountered. One group that trade on doing the pure and original forms etc. Having a fallout with an instructor and then changing the kata and making everyone learn the new version. Then stating that the one who'd left is doing the forms wrong ! Ours are the original version !!

[Mokita]

I don't think anyone knows what I'm seeing. Let me try to clear it up.

What I'm seeing is that between what's normally the fourth move (chudan soto uke) and the fifth move which is a chudan uchi uke (mid level block from the inside outward) the karateka is adding a gedan barai. The fifth move is one move before the scooping block. Every other youtube clip and everyone I've ever seen do this kata (in Shotokan) does not perform it this way.

I don't have a problem with it it's just new to me. Am I the only one seeing this?

He's preparing the Uchi Uke slightly in front & off of his hip which makes it look like an inverted Gedan Berai. It's a faster more advanced technique. As you advance in this kata, those first few blocking techniques at the start won't start exactly on your hip like a beginner does, they will be smaller moves directed more 'into' your opponent.