What makes traditional...traditional?

[Zaine]

Actually, MMA could be considered a modern version of Pankration, which goes back to the ancient Olympic games

says bushido_man96

This comes from another thread, but has sparked my answer to this thread. Because I feel the above quote is wrong, because there is no link between the two. Yes, similar concepts at work etc, but no direct link. And to me to be a tradition requires that direct link. A link beyond word of mouth, but a link of teacher to pupil, a direct transmission. To me this is the definition of traditional within the martial arts.

I think that you miss the point of what he was saying though. He was not claiming that they are linked by either tradition or direct transmission, but in conception. I think that saying MMA is the spiritual successor of Pankration is a perfectly valid (and true) statement. Are they linked? No, probably not in most cases. Does that matter? I don't think so. Furthermore, I don't believe that he was claiming any link through tradition, although I think that MMA does follow in the tradition of Pankration. The way we use tradition in the context of this thread may operate under a different understanding but in the sense that it is a tradition for cultures (especially in the west, it would seem) to have a gladiatorial event (i.e. Pankration, jousting tournaments etc.). With this in mind, I would argue that MMA does, in fact, follow in the tradition of Pankration, despite the fact that MMA is not a direct descendant of Pankration per se.

[Zaine]

I think the main thing to consider behind a tradition is "why?" Why do we do it? Why do we keep it around? If the answer is "just because," then it probably should be under consideration as to whether it should be kept or not.

I agree. There is a story I like to tell when people say (about cooking) that cook a certain way because their Mother did, as did her Mother and so forth. It is common to hear that you should cut the tip of a beef roast because "it enhances the flavor." (At least it was common where I was raised). This was because it "enhanced the flavor." However, if you trace back the myth, eventually someone will tell you that they did it so that it would fit in the pan. Martial arts is similar, I think, in the sense that there are things that we do because of tradition but the actual reason was something completely practical to the situation of its creator and has since lost it's usefulness (because we now have bigger pans).

[sensei8]

What makes something traditional? A following!!

[devil dog]

I base traditional on what my Sensei and more imortantly our Soke taught. I try hard to maintain the integrity of their teachings. I have incorporated techniques from other styles that I teach separately as added instruction for my students but as far as the main art I try to teach the way I was taught.

Of course there are some differences when it comes to Kumite. We can't teach the way we were taught back in the day without getting sued for abuse. But the core of the art is intact. Kihon, Tuite, Kata, Kumite (except for the full hard contact), Kobudo are all taught the way it was handed down.

The young man that spurred the question was reflecting on how his old instructor taught compared to me. I was mainly wanting to know what you all thought was traditional and what made it traditional for you.

To me its teaching the way the founders taught the art so as not to loose the traditions and techniques that have been passed down. Watering down of an art in my mind does it no justice. I think that most young instructors want to set themselves apart and create something unique or decide that certain techniques do not work or are not as effective as others and they discard them. There are certain techniques that I teach that in my younger days I did not understand nor find purpose in but the magic is as years go by you start to see the way to implement a technique when earlier it was useless.

The thing is the founders created these techniques based on real world applications and hid them in kata. Understanding Bunkai, Te, Kyusho and Tuite unlock these hidden techniques and true understanding of the art begins when you understand that instead of a block it is a trap, sweep, throw, or submission.

Traditional to me is preserving the art so that we may understand the complexities each art has within.