Instructor kicked my son as punishment - now what?

[Aodhan]

This behavior is totally unacceptable, it's common assault. Students should never be punished by physical violence and humiliation. I would not talk to the instructor, I would get in touch with his governing body and report the indecent in writing, copy your letter and take legal advice. I'm sorry this happened, there should be a complaints procedure for negligence in the chain of grade; The instructor's Teacher should know how he treats his students. Good Luck.

To be technical, it's battery, not assault. Assault is a verbal threat ("I'm a gonna kick yer butt!"), battery is the actual kicking of the butt.

Not only should you pursue charges in the civil system, but I would look into contacting his higher rank/association people. Someone that does that has no business teaching martial arts.

John

[mocochoco]

My experience with any situations that are even close to something like this is that they are usually exaggerated.

I'd look further into it obviously..... but I think the chances that the instructor did what we are all picturing in our heads from your description is very unlikely.

You said they were in full gear, so I assume he was wearing a chest protector as well.

I don't know.... call me cynical, but I find it hard to believe that an instructor who you and your son have obviously been happy with for some time, suddenly turns around and assaults a child.

I also find it a bit disturbing how everyone here is pretty quick to pass judgement and make very serious suggestions on how to deal with a situation that they have no clue about other than what you have been told about it by someone who wasn't even there.

I certainly wouldn't rush into "Getting the police involved" or contacting a lawyer straight away.... just take a step back and realise that in the mists of all this.... someone's life and career could be at stake here, possibly over something that has been completely blown out of proportion.

[Patrick]

I understand what you are saying, mocochoco, but you have to put yourselves in the situation that has been described in order to answer it.

If you have a child and your child's father/mother told you that they saw this happen with their own eyes, would you then disregard what your child's other parent (perhaps your spouse) said and get the other side? That's really the situation you have to answer.

The question isn't whether or not you believe JASmama, that's not important. The question is, if you were in this exact situation and your spouse told you that is exactly what happened, what would you next step be. If it would be to get the other side, that's fine. (And it, of course, depends on how much you trust your child's other parent).

No one is going to get tried or convicted of anything in these forums because we wouldn't allow it, we wouldn't allow any names to be mentioned here because this isn't the proper venue. But if you were in this exact situation, what would you do?

Thanks,

Patrick

[kensei]

My experience with any situations that are even close to something like this is that they are usually exaggerated.

I'd look further into it obviously..... but I think the chances that the instructor did what we are all picturing in our heads from your description is very unlikely.

I have to say I am from the old school when we saw instructors strike students all the friggin time, it was horrible but accepted a bit more in teh 70's and 80's and part of me says we see to many brats running around doing stupid things and hurting others and the spare the rod idea is agreat way to make sure we have issues...the other part (the parent in me) says that their is actually no reason that could be given by an instructor for striking a child that would make it okay.

Dressing them down and even kicking them out of class for such behavior is proper, kicking them in the guts...well not so much.

You said they were in full gear, so I assume he was wearing a chest protector as well.

and that matters how? In the 80's I dropped by big brother who was wearing one of those TKD chest protectors, He was about 2 feet taller than me and about 80 pounds heavier. An adult hitting that thing would still make a impact and hurt the kid. Not only that but he is in front of the class and not ready to be hurt...shock and such and being embarassed probably hurt worse than the gut shot but seriously...who cares if he is wearing a TKD chest pad?

I also find it a bit disturbing how everyone here is pretty quick to pass judgement and make very serious suggestions on how to deal with a situation that they have no clue about other than what you have been told about it by someone who wasn't even there.

A) I dont see anyone condemning the guy, they are all suggesting that she pass on her info to the cops and or owner. They are not passing judgement on the instructor but saying anyone that does what he is accused of should not be teaching, and I would assume you would say the same thing!

B) even if he did not do what he was accused of by the kid and the adult their is no harm in bringing it to the owners attention! That way the whole thing gets worked out.

I certainly wouldn't rush into "Getting the police involved" or contacting a lawyer straight away.... just take a step back and realise that in the mists of all this.... someone's life and career could be at stake here, possibly over something that has been completely blown out of proportion.

Good point...but to counter that, if we dont get this taken care of we could have an child abuser teaching children! I think it is more than a little appropriate for the mother of a child who says that he was struck...and has an adult back up his story to go to the authorities and or the owner and get this guy checked out. It could be nothing, but if its something being a wet cloth over the whole thing is more dangerous for others that might get hurt by him.

Yes, go at it smart...but go at it!

[CredoTe]

My experience with any situations that are even close to something like this is that they are usually exaggerated.

I'd look further into it obviously..... but I think the chances that the instructor did what we are all picturing in our heads from your description is very unlikely.

I have to say I am from the old school when we saw instructors strike students all the friggin time, it was horrible but accepted a bit more in teh 70's and 80's and part of me says we see to many brats running around doing stupid things and hurting others and the spare the rod idea is agreat way to make sure we have issues...the other part (the parent in me) says that their is actually no reason that could be given by an instructor for striking a child that would make it okay.

Dressing them down and even kicking them out of class for such behavior is proper, kicking them in the guts...well not so much.

You said they were in full gear, so I assume he was wearing a chest protector as well.

and that matters how? In the 80's I dropped by big brother who was wearing one of those TKD chest protectors, He was about 2 feet taller than me and about 80 pounds heavier. An adult hitting that thing would still make a impact and hurt the kid. Not only that but he is in front of the class and not ready to be hurt...shock and such and being embarassed probably hurt worse than the gut shot but seriously...who cares if he is wearing a TKD chest pad?

I also find it a bit disturbing how everyone here is pretty quick to pass judgement and make very serious suggestions on how to deal with a situation that they have no clue about other than what you have been told about it by someone who wasn't even there.

A) I dont see anyone condemning the guy, they are all suggesting that she pass on her info to the cops and or owner. They are not passing judgement on the instructor but saying anyone that does what he is accused of should not be teaching, and I would assume you would say the same thing!

B) even if he did not do what he was accused of by the kid and the adult their is no harm in bringing it to the owners attention! That way the whole thing gets worked out.

I certainly wouldn't rush into "Getting the police involved" or contacting a lawyer straight away.... just take a step back and realise that in the mists of all this.... someone's life and career could be at stake here, possibly over something that has been completely blown out of proportion.

Good point...but to counter that, if we dont get this taken care of we could have an child abuser teaching children! I think it is more than a little appropriate for the mother of a child who says that he was struck...and has an adult back up his story to go to the authorities and or the owner and get this guy checked out. It could be nothing, but if its something being a wet cloth over the whole thing is more dangerous for others that might get hurt by him.

Yes, go at it smart...but go at it!

Great post!

[mocochoco]

Let me start by apologising. I have to say that at first I didn't read this thread as thoroughly as I should have and therefore missed important points, such as the fact that the adult who witnessed it was in fact the child's father - which obviously does make a huge difference in terms of credibility of the incident.

So I should have waited to comment until I'd had a proper chance to read the thread in more detail.

However, I have an overwhelming feeling that what happened is being exaggerated somewhat. I don't know why, but I just don't believe that the picture that has been painted about the situation would be an accurate portrayal to what happened if we could somehow watch a video of how it went down.

If it was really that bad of a situation that they felt so threatened/concerned that the possibility of getting authorities, lawyers etc involved... I think it would be clear cut and they wouldn't need to be coming to a martial arts forum to seek advice on that .

If it was my child and I watched them get assaulted to the point that I felt they, or other people were in genuine danger.... I certainly wouldn't sit back and watch, pretend nothing happened... then go and ask random people who were not there what I should do about it.

Also the fact that noone else made any complaints or reacted to the incident immediately also makes me doubt that it was really that dramatic.

I think in general that JASmama has taken the right steps to deal with the situation. The main thing that concerned me is some of the people on here that I have noticed making pretty rash suggestions to JASmama about how they would recommend dealing with it.

[ps1]

Any resolution on this yet? Have you taken any action?

[Patrick]

No worries, mocochoco. I appreciate what you are saying and thank you for bringing a different perspective to the thread.

I would also say that people react differently and if you don't know martial arts culture enough, you might think this is maybe normal or you might not want to embarrass your son by jumping onto the mat, etc. I mean, I'm with you, if it were my son, I probably would have done something right then and there but still... that's why we're human and different. Not everyone is as confident, assertive or sure of themselves.

Patrick

[Harkon72]

If it were a junior member of my Family, the instructor would have to test against someone his own size!

[Kuma]

To be technical, it's battery, not assault. Assault is a verbal threat ("I'm a gonna kick yer butt!"), battery is the actual kicking of the butt.

Depends on the region you live. In my state, we have assault charges for the act of actually injuring someone, and for threats it's a different charge (either harassment or terroristic threats, depending upon the severity).

I'd like to know what if any action was taken as well.