American Based (Are We That Unworthy?)

[maisweh]

this thread looks more and more like "where the best is."

i think karate, i think white or black uniforms with people in line punching and kicking with pseudobuddhism mixed in. i dont necesarily (sp) think that Japan is the "best." rafael agheyev, luca valdesi, raymond daniels, zsolt moradi... none of them are japanese... of course thats sports speaking.

now football wise, new orleans saints or san francisco is where everyone should be

[Kusotare]

I think white or black uniforms with people in line punching and kicking with pseudo buddhism mixed in

What is the significance of the uniform?

As far as Buddhism is concerned - that doesn't interest me.

Budo on the other hand is pretty key.

K.

[maisweh]

I think white or black uniforms with people in line punching and kicking with pseudo buddhism mixed in

What is the significance of the uniform?

As far as Buddhism is concerned - that doesn't interest me.

Budo on the other hand is pretty key.

K.

what is the signifance of it being koryu or being from japan?

im saying when i "think" of karate or when most people think of it, thats what they think of. i also never said buddhism, i said pseudobuddihsm, where instructors want to be addressed as super grandmaster guru sensei and spew out feel good quotes from various sources and market it as some kind of japanese spirituality.

[Kusotare]

I think white or black uniforms with people in line punching and kicking with pseudo buddhism mixed in

What is the significance of the uniform?

As far as Buddhism is concerned - that doesn't interest me.

Budo on the other hand is pretty key.

K.

what is the signifance of it being koryu or being from japan?

im saying when i "think" of karate or when most people think of it, thats what they think of. i also never said buddhism, i said pseudobuddihsm, where instructors want to be addressed as super grandmaster guru sensei and spew out feel good quotes from various sources and market it as some kind of japanese spirituality.

I think perhaps that's more in America than anywhere else?

K.

[kensei]

what is the signifance of it being koryu or being from japan?

im saying when i "think" of karate or when most people think of it, thats what they think of. i also never said buddhism, i said pseudobuddihsm, where instructors want to be addressed as super grandmaster guru sensei and spew out feel good quotes from various sources and market it as some kind of japanese spirituality.

First off Koryu means "Old school" in JAPANESE and refers to ancient martial arts...it does not in any way mean Okinawan, which to be frank woudl be Gendai Budo...or new age budo styles as they are NOT as old as the Koryu schools.

Other than that...kind of agree with you here.

[maisweh]

what is the signifance of it being koryu or being from japan?

im saying when i "think" of karate or when most people think of it, thats what they think of. i also never said buddhism, i said pseudobuddihsm, where instructors want to be addressed as super grandmaster guru sensei and spew out feel good quotes from various sources and market it as some kind of japanese spirituality.

First off Koryu means "Old school" in JAPANESE and refers to ancient martial arts...it does not in any way mean Okinawan, which to be frank woudl be Gendai Budo...or new age budo styles as they are NOT as old as the Koryu schools.

Other than that...kind of agree with you here.

didnt mean it as a question or acting like i dont know what it was, it was more in terms of what is significant about it being a koryu or being directly from japan?

and yes, it must be an american thing. must not have made it to other countries yet. i can just do a quick google search and find all kind of jokes with these instructors and schools

[kensei]

Applogies if that came across harsh, I am a bit picky with things lik that as we see so many people misreprosent things and then the students they have pass on the mistakes.....sorry.

we had a gent here in my town who started off teaching a self created form that he called Kempo Karate...no association with other kempo groups. He began as "Sensei" then moved on to "Master", from their he became "Grand master" and finally the....wait for it...."GRAND WHITE WIZZARD"....not realizing that this is a KKK title he became the only Karate/Kung fu instructor in the world that got a letter from the KKK to stop using a term/title they use!

Point being what is wrong with the Shogu Sensei? It is a huge honor for anyone to call me that as it means that I am now seen as a Karate instructor and the same title my instructor uses is now applied to me! thats an honor...keep your psudo buddist titles, I prefer simple and straight foward titles!

[xo-karate]

American based... I was part of a project or a phase in Finnish karate where we wanted to make Karate more Finnish. We called it Finn Karate Do. We included modern knowledge of coaching and teaching and tried to include techniques that worked in competition.

(At that era we won several world championships and were quite good.)

Next generation wanted to go back to traditional karate - ok they have there reasons and one was that competition karate is not effective for self defense. So we did Finnish Karate.

Brazilians did here own Judo - it's not bad:)

If you want to have karate as a Japanese cultural study, it's a great solution. Very much to learn, but every thing is not done in most effective way for a western. We live in a different environment - mentally and socially.

I am sure that American karate is good - and also very bad. Problem is same is not good for me and for the next guy.

[maisweh]

Applogies if that came across harsh, I am a bit picky with things lik that as we see so many people misreprosent things and then the students they have pass on the mistakes.....sorry.

we had a gent here in my town who started off teaching a self created form that he called Kempo Karate...no association with other kempo groups. He began as "Sensei" then moved on to "Master", from their he became "Grand master" and finally the....wait for it...."GRAND WHITE WIZZARD"....not realizing that this is a KKK title he became the only Karate/Kung fu instructor in the world that got a letter from the KKK to stop using a term/title they use!

Point being what is wrong with the Shogu Sensei? It is a huge honor for anyone to call me that as it means that I am now seen as a Karate instructor and the same title my instructor uses is now applied to me! thats an honor...keep your psudo buddist titles, I prefer simple and straight foward titles!

the KKK thing had me laughing. my title? coach. that's it. just coach. other sports use it, so i do too. i don't claim to have any relation to the japanese, except that i do karate. thats it, karate.

the only thing that irks me is the CONSTANT use of ossu, ush, oss, or whatever you want without realizing what it actually means. they use it like a word that can mean anything from hello, to good job, to hey, can you get me a drink.

one guy split off from our school, put all the blackbelt stuff first and whitebelt stuff last, paid some money to an association, and jumped from 3rd to 6th degree. his title is kabuki sensei. funny thing is that kabuki is just a japanese play plus, our system of karate only goes to 5th degree.

[Kusotare]

Maisweh, your stance about not needing to be associated with a larger group / governing body (Japanese or otherwise) is clear. You obviously feel you can develop better by going it alone and only you can know that.

I would also agree about your comments "Shogu" gods with their smoke and mirrors; however you seem to want to dismiss every other legitimate connection that karate has with Japan – apart from the name “Karate”

Can I ask, do you call what you do Karate? Do you train in Karate gi? Do you operate a Kyu / Dan System? Do you have solo and paired Kata?

Having any or all of the above in no way reflects how good (or bad) your karate is so, what’s the point in having them, particularly if you want to isolate yourself from other Karate associations - and distance yourself from anything Japanese?

I don’t ask this in a derogatory way I find it genuinely interesting.

I have an acquaintance on another internet forum that started off life training Shotokan karate with a traditional group. He eventually formed his own group concentrating on conflict management and now teaches seminars around the country and has penned a number of books. He very rarely wears a karate suit these days and he does not call what he does karate. Interestingly enough though, his system is based around the pinan katas.

Do you need to call what you do Karate?

K.