Title VS Rank

[sensei8]

In addition...

I continue to refuse the insistence of the Hombu wanting to promote me to Kudan, a rank that the Hombu continues to shove down my throat due to what's written in the By-Laws.

Not now...not ever!!

[quinteros1963]

Both are earned, but for me I don't thing either is important. I train out of enjoyment for learning and staying in shape. Rank and titles will follow as result of training.

[ninjanurse]

Rank is awarded due to personal hard work and sweat, a title is earned by your actions towards others.

[pittbullJudoka]

I would have to say they're not so much important to me but something I'm proud of. I'm proud of both my titles and rank due to the fact I've worked hard to earn both. And both have been bestowed upon me by my instructors meaning they feel that I have proven myself to be worthy of both title and rank that they have given me. I posted several years ago about dealing with the title Sensei after after receiving it. It wasn't so much having the title but others referring to me in that way because it was a title for my instructors at the time. I took several weeks to get use to it because before that I was just sempi the señor ranking student.

The only time rank ever became important to was when I was a teenager training at my first dojo. And I let that cloud my training and ended up failing a Kyu test and I vowed from that moment on that I didn't care about rank and have yet to fail a promotion exam since. Since and now I just try to learn and teach my students the best I can.

But again I say both because I earned them from my instructors. Proud not important

[kensei]

Hey Sensei8 ,

By no means is this in anyway a conviction of you and your practice, which is dictated by your group and not yourself. But it is not in tune with the use of Shugo or should I say the past use of Shugo. Shugo titles are part of the old Menkyo Keiden system of "ranking" or to be more accurate licencing for instructors. The Koryu systems of martial arts in Japan used them and NOT in Okinawa. The schools of Kenjutsu, Iaido and the many other Bujutsu schools used the titles/licence as a form of ranking the instructors, and really from my point of view it was a marketing idea gone horribly wrong!

Titles are STILL be awarded in Japan and Okinawa...STILL!!

The use of Menkyo Shogu in Okinawa is reletivly new and the use in Japan is adopted from the Koryu systmes as a marketing tool. When Jigaro Kano did away with them he developed the Kyu/Dan system to clarify student ranking and give flexibility to ranks...at least that is the story they give out. I think its just another way of rewarding students for sticking about. the Menkyo system was reserved for older systems of Jujitsu and Koryu weapons systems.

Karate never had a ranking system, nor did it use the Menkyo licences. When the instructors came to Japan they adopted the Kyu/Dan system and MANY years later some of the systems used the Shugo for high ranking instructors. And before anyone says "well they used the term Sensei"....Yes they did....so do universities and elementry schools....it means teacher.

The use of the Shugo system is post WW2 and I have no doubt that some use it to reward and identify people, and that is great! No issues, just want to be clear that this is a re-using of an old system not a link to the past....not really.

I don't understand why I'm lampooned because I speak about Rank/Title especially when it's within our By-Laws, and the By-Laws weren't written by me. I'm just stating that my titles mean more to me than rank for reasons I've already stated.

by no means am I lampooning you, and your by-laws are what they are. Following them is a rule in most clubs/orgs. and I respect that you guys use the titles to identify individuals. I just dont partake in that kind of title use. I can actually understand part of your point of view, a title is awarded based on your rank, understanding and in the old days, supposedly, your ability to pass on the arts core basics and philosophy. While rank just means you stuck it out and tested a bunch of times.

I wish that they never existed but they do!!

the use of Shugo may not jive with my training and my experience in a traditional martial arts organization but its cool if someone else wants to use them or uses them because it is common practice in a group. I did not mean to make fun of or make light of an individuals practice, I just wanted to be clear that they are not ancient Karate titles, they are titles used by Koryu systems, of which Karate is not a Koryu system.

I guess its better than some groups that use "grand master" and "your Honor" when refering to members of the higher rankings.

[sensei8]

kensei,

I appreciate everything that you've posted; well written and well defined. Thank you!!

[xo-karate]

I'm starting to like my newest title - professor.

To me it says I know something and also that I don't know very much about most of the things. Professor knows his own sector, but is often very ignorant in other subjects.

Also I like the connotation that I'm not following a Japan Martial Arts. I ow a lot to old masters, but this is my karate - I'm the professor of my work. It does not mean I invented it. It means I am researching it.

Also professor has a meaning of teaching - sharing.

And I did not point my self as a professor. It was by Institute of Martial Arts and Science.

This is the first time I'm using it - so I'm still tasting and wondering - should I redesign my letterheads and business cards:-)