ITF Kicking Terminology...looking for clarification

[bushido_man96]

Thumbing through vol 5 of General Choi's Encyclopedia of Takewon-do, on pp 16 is some kicking terminology that I would like to get some clarification on.

Double Kick: If the same type of kick is delivered twice in succession in the same direction by the same foot, it is called a double kick, and can be executed against one or two opponents.

I'm wondering, are these two kicks done without setting the foot down, or can the foot touch the ground and then come back up and kick? I'm inclined to think it is without setting the foot down, but am curious to know for sure. I grew up under different terminology, and we would call this "repeat kicking."

Triple Kick: If the same type of kick is delivered three times in succession in the same direction by the same foot, it is called a triple kick.

Same question here. I'm guessing "repeat kicking." But we would call any two or more kicks performed without setting the foot down, but the kick could change. Like a round kick, repeat side kick, or front kick, repeat round kick.

Consecutive Kick: When two or more kicks are executed in succession by the same foot in different directions and or with different tools.

Again, is this with or without setting the foot down between kicks? Is there an ITF pattern I'm not thinking of where this happens (or one I don't do)? In the ATA purple belt form, we do a front kick to a front target, re-chamber, and then do a side kick with the same foot, no set down, to the side. That's what I think of with this term.

Combination Kick: When both feet are used to deliver two or more kicks in succession, it is called a combination kick. This terminology, however, is used generally for flying kicks.

So, I see flying three directional kick in my mind here. I also think of the combination in Choong Moo of back leg round, spin side kick. Does setting a foot down to the ground nullify this terminology?

Any help in clarification would be great!

[DWx]

As far as I understand it, these descriptions are all for kicks where you don't set the foot down in between. Otherwise they would singular kicks. I don't have the 15 volume set to hand but in the condensed encyclopedia (volume 4, pg 284) it says about consecutive kicks:

... good balance must be maintained at all times with the stationery foot so that the kicking foot can execute a continuous kick without lowering it to the ground or floor.

Consecutive kicks or yonsok chagi are when you do several different kicks from the same leg without putting your foot down in between. You can have double consecutive kicks (2 in a row), triple consecutive kicks (3 in a row) etc. For example moves 13-14 and 17-18 in Kwang-Gae, the pressing kicks-side kicks. Or moves 13-14 and 18-19 in Choi-Yong, hook kick-turning kick combos.

When just saying "double kick" I've always taken that to mean doing the same type of kick twice without putting the foot down.

Then combination kicks are kicking with both legs simultaneously in the air. Like a 2-directional split kick (as seen in Juche). Although the kicks in Choong-Moo are done one after the other in combination I don't think they are specifically called combination kicks.

[bushido_man96]

Thanks for clearing this up for me, it really helps.

[DWx]

You're welcome

The only point I'm unsure about, is whether a middle roundhouse then high roundhouse would count as a consecutive kick or not? I'd be inclined to say they aren't different kicks so they're not consecutive but I don't know for sure.

[bushido_man96]

Yeah, I think they would fall into double kick.

Another question; in Kwang Gae, is the pressing kick a slow kick? We do them as two side kicks, one low and one high. So for us, they would be a double kick.

[DWx]

We don't do it slow but for us the low pressing kick is a different type of kick to a low side kick so in Kwang-Gae we call it consecutive. We target the side or back of someone's knee and it's done without that piercing action... like a press down onto the joint. Not slow but without that acceleration and with more weight down. One of the few times we specifically don't turn the standing foot.

[bushido_man96]

Ok, that makes sense. Since you aren't pivoting the base foot, and not revolving the hip, its not a piercing kick, hence the different terminology. Right?

[DWx]

Yeah its like the difference between a piercing kick and a pushing kick. Different purpose and different actions so they're 2 distinct kicks, hence consecutive and not just double.

Pressing kicks are weird anyway. Intended to put pressure on a joint whereas, personally, I'd just strike it if I had the opportunity.

[bushido_man96]

I agree with that, striking as opposed to just pressure.

So, when you do a pushing side kick, what's the difference from a piercing side kick? Is it not pivoting as much, and you just slow it and push instead of piercing?

[DWx]

I agree with that, striking as opposed to just pressure.

So, when you do a pushing side kick, what's the difference from a piercing side kick? Is it not pivoting as much, and you just slow it and push instead of piercing?

Essentially that. I do pivot the back leg and the mechanics of the kick are the same as the piercing version. The main difference is though is when in the kick connects and where the focus is.

When I do the piercing version, I'm looking to connect right at the end when I'm just about to lock out the leg. That's where the kick ends and I start to retrieve the leg. With a pushing kick, the acceleration perhaps isn't so much but then I also connect slightly before full extension. After contact I'm still using my mass to and strength to force the kick to extension and push through the target. Retrieving the leg isn't so important and my mass is probably still going forward at that point. Analogous to impact blocks and non-impact (parry) blocks.

How do you do yours? We also have thrusting side kicks but I don't really do them myself.