Rolling: Shoulder Roll or Judo Roll?

[cheesefrysamurai]

I Agree with Kuma.

My only point is when you are falling or have been thrown in such a way where all the force is aimed directly at the floor, proper ukemi is needed.

[JusticeZero]

(as what you are describing sounds exactly like the third technique demonstrated on this page: http://www.judo-ch.jp/english/knowledge/ukemi/ ).

Yeah, that diagram looks similar. When i've seen that one explained by a japanese stylist though, possibly not the best or most detailed source but they all seemed to feel they were qualified, it looks like they're landing on their elbows immediately following slapping the ground with their palm; it always looked odd to me. I'm probably missing something on that.

[JusticeZero]

My only point is when you are falling or have been thrown in such a way where all the force is aimed directly at the floor, proper ukemi is needed.

I don't think that was ever debated. I assume i'm reading "ukemi" right as an equivalent to "técnicas de queda".

[JusticeZero]

watch harai goshi and yoko gake

I've used techniques somewhat similar to those two a few times, but nowhere near the exact same thing. I have a suspicion I know more or less where the "bad example" in that video derived his technique from, if he learned from a Brazilian teacher who's done any of what we do, but if so, he's doing it very wrong nonetheless to the point where it is indeed an example of what not to do. Maybe because it is horribly twisted to fit into a roll on a mat.

[cheesefrysamurai]

You are. My teacher explained it as:

"bend your elbows with your hands in front of you, with your pointer fingers and thumbs making a diamond shape in front of your face, then fall foward like you are doing a belly flop and TURN YOUR HEAD IN EITHER DIRECTION. when you get close to the floor, slap the floor with your hands (the diamond). your arms are between your body and the floor and the slap seems of take the bite out of the fall

I have fallen on concrete and because of my training it comes out.

(as what you are describing sounds exactly like the third technique demonstrated on this page: http://www.judo-ch.jp/english/knowledge/ukemi/ ).

Yeah, that diagram looks similar. When i've seen that one explained by a japanese stylist though, possibly not the best or most detailed source but they all seemed to feel they were qualified, it looks like they're landing on their elbows immediately following slapping the ground with their palm; it always looked odd to me. I'm probably missing something on that.

[JusticeZero]

OK.

We don't do diamond shapes like that because that splits the thumb and fingers enough that a lot of people don't put the heel of the hand down. Makes a hyperextension danger to the knuckles. As far as the slap, it's all about applying a total acceleration that counters or redirects the mass of your body, so I just blend the movement down. Makes it easier to redirect the energy to transition it into stances, I think.

[barrypardue]

I am a 1st Dan in Judo and have no idea what is going on in roll 1 looks like really bad form or goofing off

[JusticeZero]

Well, if the "Kim" in the style name refers to Ashida Kim, then it's probably some sort've odd gongfu-jujutsu hybrid made by a guy who tried capitalizing on the "Ninja Craze" with a bunch of books about "ninjutsu", using all Chinese technique names and suchlike.