Belt test questions for 12 year old.

[AdamKralic]

Greetings. First time post so forgive a bit of background intro type stuff before I get to the meat of the question.

I am a karate Dad. My son (who turned 12 today) is enrolled at a large karate chain. We are 2.5 years in and my son recently was awarded his brown belt. My son has a talent for karate and more specifically sparring. Enough so that he's been put into the upper belt sparring classes since he was a blue belt. He's also training with the national touring team and is their only male child in his age bracket. (but man o man the girl on the team that my son fights with is GOOOOOD)

This is the start of my question: My son for the past four months or so has been going to 4 classes a week. 1 form at his regular school, 1 sparring at his regular school, 1 sparring with the national team leader but at his regular school, 1 sparring with same leader at the invite-only national team practices.

Now as many of you probably know...chains largely go by how many classes one attends to be ready to try out for next belt. At this point my son has (50) classes in-between tests. I'm not trying to circumvent anything. I have these questions: All of my son's classes should count...no? Does the invite-only class count as more than one. The national team leader said that in his day such a class would count as 10. Now he absolutely delivers a "10" in comparison to the regular school classes...and the competition is certainly a 10 but idk that seems too much. Especially as it's 100% fighting. I mean that is maybe 50% of the tests.

I haven't bothered to report any of my son's extra classes to his regular school yet. (it is all one family...I'm not going outside the family so to speak) A) I should...right? B) Should I ask about credit value of the invite-only class too? How would you word that?

The overall goal is to see if with intense training it would be possible to go from brown to black in 1 year. (so as to fight in the touring circuit)

Thanks.

[DoctorQui]

Greetings. First time post so forgive a bit of background intro type stuff before I get to the meat of the question.

I am a karate Dad. My son (who turned 12 today) is enrolled at a large karate chain. We are 2.5 years in and my son recently was awarded his brown belt. My son has a talent for karate and more specifically sparring. Enough so that he's been put into the upper belt sparring classes since he was a blue belt. He's also training with the national touring team and is their only male child in his age bracket. (but man o man the girl on the team that my son fights with is GOOOOOD)

This is the start of my question: My son for the past four months or so has been going to 4 classes a week. 1 form at his regular school, 1 sparring at his regular school, 1 sparring with the national team leader but at his regular school, 1 sparring with same leader at the invite-only national team practices.

Now as many of you probably know...chains largely go by how many classes one attends to be ready to try out for next belt. At this point my son has (50) classes in-between tests. I'm not trying to circumvent anything. I have these questions: All of my son's classes should count...no? Does the invite-only class count as more than one. The national team leader said that in his day such a class would count as 10. Now he absolutely delivers a "10" in comparison to the regular school classes...and the competition is certainly a 10 but idk that seems too much. Especially as it's 100% fighting. I mean that is maybe 50% of the tests.

I haven't bothered to report any of my son's extra classes to his regular school yet. (it is all one family...I'm not going outside the family so to speak) A) I should...right? B) Should I ask about credit value of the invite-only class too? How would you word that?

The overall goal is to see if with intense training it would be possible to go from brown to black in 1 year. (so as to fight in the touring circuit)

Thanks.

I think the only way you will get an answer to this question is to ask the club. Different clubs and affiliations have different rules on when a junior can take a grading.

In my club, juniors can grade every 3 months providing they have the equiv of at least two sessions a week under their belt (excuse pun!) when they get to brown belt, there is a mandatory 6 months between belts again providing they have the equiv of 2 sessions per week.

However, thats just my club and an example!

[Dobbersky]

I'm glad you are proud of your son and want him to progress but Brown belt is a milestone in a Karateka’s (someone who practices Karate) journey. I would not look at how quickly your son can reach black belt as this would instigate a belt factory that's only in it for YOUR money but whether it’s HIS lifetime's journey not yours. I had a student take 8 years, yes 8 years, to get to Black belt, he started at 8 and is now 15, he waited 2 years from 1st Kyu or 3rd brown depending on the school before he was invited to grade for Junior Black belt. It’s a minimum of 6 months between each Brown belt and 12 months minimum between 1st Kyu and 1st Dan.

So remember it’s not a race, he will grade WHEN his Instructor says he can grade, not before.

With Respect: Don't rush him as if you rush him into it too fast he will end up resenting Karate and maybe resenting you.

[AdamKralic]

I'm glad you are proud of your son and want him to progress but Brown belt is a milestone in a Karateka’s (someone who practices Karate) journey. I would not look at how quickly your son can reach black belt as this would instigate a belt factory that's only in it for YOUR money but whether it’s HIS lifetime's journey not yours. I had a student take 8 years, yes 8 years, to get to Black belt, he started at 8 and is now 15, he waited 2 years from 1st Kyu or 3rd brown depending on the school before he was invited to grade for Junior Black belt. It’s a minimum of 6 months between each Brown belt and 12 months minimum between 1st Kyu and 1st Dan.

So remember it’s not a race, he will grade WHEN his Instructor says he can grade, not before.

With Respect: Don't rush him as if you rush him into it too fast he will end up resenting Karate and maybe resenting you.

You make excellent points. I thank you for the blunt approach. I'm pretty sure that we are in a belt factory/McDojo. His regular classes contain some pretty poor students imho. (brown belts that have a hard time kicking above belt level for example) The belt colors are almost meaningless because of this (also imho) REalizing this...I sought any additional training for my son that was possible. Eventually the national team leader was there, saw my son and heard about him from his teachers. I of course was all over the idea of my son training with him.

This instructor is a 10 time consecutive national champion. Both of his sons are national champions...and the older one teaches with him. The older son is the one that asks when me when my son is up for this that or the other belt so as to know when he'll be able to compete in _______________ tournament in _____________ location. Very personable, upbeat kid; the son is. He had a 1st degree black belt come into their regular sparring class and my son beat him. Since then he has been "enthusiastic" about advancement. (He is a 17 year old...even a disciplined one is prone to enthusiasm) He will make a A+++++++ instructor when the time has come though...no doubts Father is hard. Just hard. Not mean. Not unpleasant...hard. (His father before him was a karate sensi)

They want the faster advancement. At his regular classes...my son is one of 20 - 25 kids...going through the drills. The only change that they make for him is that he fights higher belts...and against fighters a good 6" - a foot taller than him. (I personally don't see this helping as they tend to be slow and awkward imho)

I do not want to have my son resent me at all! I train with him. I take him to the classes. I of course worry about the balance between enough, too much and not enough. I also feel awkward approaching my son's regular teacher about any of this really.

[Harkon72]

This way of deciding if you are ready to grade is completely Alien to our club, you don't measure someone's aptitude for Karate by how many hours of training you have done! Or in reality how much you have spent! You are graded on your Karate only. Some student could have one lesson with our Sensei, and if they are to standard, they would pass a grade. We don't want your money, all we want is to produce good Karateka. A student could study 12 hours a week for three months, and if they were not up to standard, they would fail the test. Do they offer fries with Kata?

[bushido_man96]

Ask you questions of the school instructor. Don't be shy, I'm sure you won't have been the first to ask such questions, and he should provide suitable explanations to your questions.

[AdamKralic]

Well I asked. He said they'd count the regular sparring class with the national team instructor...but not the national team practices.

I of course wouldn't dream of arguing as I'm not THAT Dad.

But I look forward to casually mentioning to the team director that his national team practices don't count...not for 10...and not even for 1. (remember he said that when he was a child...they counted as 10.)

The regular school lead said that the time between belts was for seasoning the students. Again I'm not a complainer...so I did not.

Me? I would've advanced students by ability. There should not be belts at my son's belt level without the ability to do anything well. Conversely there shouldn't be students that know all the kata/defense/sparring atleast at belt level that have to endure lectures to the class about not paying attention in class, about how to do a backfist properly. (seriously...brown belts that still need basic punches refreshers)

My two cents. Thanks for providing me a forum to voice my thoughts.

[Dobbersky]

Ask you questions of the school instructor. Don't be shy, I'm sure you won't have been the first to ask such questions, and he should provide suitable explanations to your questions.

Totally agree with this. Most black belt take around 4 years from white regardless of lessons per week. And 3rd Kyu/Gup to 1st Dan should be a minimum of 2 years.

[DWx]

It does depend on the individual school as to how they decide when somebody is ready for promotion and whether something counts. In my school we have a minimum number of dojang hours you have to do between each promotion but meeting that criteria doesn't equal promotion. For us, national training also did not count as it is not a lesson as such but training. Whilst you do learn some stuff and the caliber of those you are training with is higher, training at that sort of venue is more about tournament training that martial arts in general. So you're spending time learning tactics not techniques.

From personal experience, I know you're keen for your son to advance quickly and get good, but don't try to force too much too soon otherwise he'll burn out. You mentioned you wanted to get him on the touring circuit? There is no need to rush that at all as he's only 12 and you'd be better off getting him really good before jumping into it as it is very expensive and time consuming. I presume it's the sparring he'd be competing in? Don't worry too much about who he's sparring in class as you'd probably get more out of him by working more on pad drills and footwork drills. Then when he's sparring in class, if the students are of lesser ability, tell him he should be doing things like working his bad side only or that he must land a certain combo over the bout or he can only use footwork and evasion as a defense.

[AdamKralic]

Thanks for the input. I learned they test twice per year for black belt so I am less concerned than I was. If it was only once per year I was thinking that it'd be a lot to advance in 12 months.

With 18 months as a possibility I feel more at ease for my son.

(for the tournaments they do them by age brackets every 2 years...as a Father I of course would prefer my son to start on the last year of a bracket as opposed to JUST qualifying for a brand new bracket)

I really do not want to burn him out. Despite what my attitude here might indicate...I do not talk karate 24/7 or anything. (Though I will admit to thinking on karate quite a bit) I give days off...I have school work first priority...etc.

thanks again for all the input. P.S. Been reading the heck outta technique posts here...great info to be gleaned.