Transition from Shotokan to Kyokushin

[JohnnyB]

I find the lack of sparring in my shotokan dojo disturbing. I don't feel like doing 1 step kumite drills for 1 more year while paying for belts and exams. According to our curriculum we do Jiyu kumite only after 2nd Kyu and even then its light point sparring.

Really if I spend all this time training I would like to practice them in a mean other than thin air. Don't get me wrong I respect the art but I would like more aliveness in the dojo.

There are few decent looking kyokushin dojos in Athens so I'll be looking to do some tryouts starting from the closest one.

As I currently have 6th Kyu in shotokan do you think it will take me lots of time to reach the equivalent grade?

[Wastelander]

I find the lack of sparring in my shotokan dojo disturbing. I don't feel like doing 1 step kumite drills for 1 more year while paying for belts and exams. According to our curriculum we do Jiyu kumite only after 2nd Kyu and even then its light point sparring.

Really if I spend all this time training I would like to practice them in a mean other than thin air. Don't get me wrong I respect the art but I would like more aliveness in the dojo.

There are few decent looking kyokushin dojos in Athens so I'll be looking to do some tryouts starting from the closest one.

As I currently have 6th Kyu in shotokan do you think it will take me lots of time to reach the equivalent grade?

What is more important than your rank is how long and how often you have been training. I am guessing you have probably been training for about a year, which would mean you have likely built up some muscle memory that will take time to change in order to modify your techniques to fit Kyokushin. You may be able to understand concepts more quickly than other white belts that are just starting, but it will most likely take you longer to get your form correct because you have to override what you have already learned. Karate is a life-long journey, so don't worry about the grade.

The bottom line is this; if you want to train in a style that utilizes full contact sparring and you feel that Kyokushin is a good fit, then just start training in Kyokushin and enjoy it.

[JohnnyB]

Yes its about 1 year of training that I have developed muscle memory in Shotokan forms.

However i have no idea how my stand up kumite is going to look since I have never done any..!

Was having flashbacks of evergrey's stories about other Karate Styles joining their open tournaments where only few managed ok but many others quite bad and i don't want to find myself in this position really.

[Dobbersky]

Shotokan is an excellent style of Karate and it depends completely on the fighter, I have sparred with some Shotokan Karateka knockdown rules and they found it extremely hard to switch but I have sparred with others who find it like a walk in the park

[DoctorQui]

I went Wado to Shotokan and I can tell you that muscle memory is a pain in the rear particularly when you are allowed to keep your rank. You will make a lot of infuriating rookie mistakes and you will be much harder on yourself because you will have built yourself up as a reasonable karateka at this point.

I find Shotokan a really good style and not all clubs are run the same.

My advice is if you ain't happy, look for something else BUT always remember that the grass only ever looks greener!

[ps1]

Sounds like you'll be much happier in Kyokushin. Go for it!

[evergrey]

OSU,

You will have some advantages, and might progress more quickly at first.

On the other hand, if anything has been trained into you that doesn't work with Kyokushin, it will be harder to "fix" it than someone with a blank slate who hasn't learned it some other way first.

It also really does depend on the Shotokan org and indivitual dojos. There are some Shotokan orgs that go pretty hard, and others who only ever do feather-light point sparring. I ended up sparring a Shotokan nidan from the latter category who had made a big stink about her rank. I made her cry. I was trying to go light with her. I felt like a jerk, heh! But yes, it really depends.

It does sound like Kyokushin would work better for you. It shouldn't be that hard of a stretch, as Funakoshi trained Oyama for years.

OSU!

[pers]

I don't think at 6th kyu level you should worry too much about sparring , rather you should concentrate on buliding strong fundementals ,just basics and more basics including basic kumite ....it's all there for a porpuse .

It may look boring and you feel like giving up but if you stick with it ,it will serve you well later on down the line and then you can bulid on that your own preferances and I promise you can walk into any club from any style and not embarrass yourself .

But if you are in too much of a hurry to sparr why don't you join a kickboxing club ,they have a diferrent aproach and almost straight away you will be sparring . no katas involved and it is more a sport than martial arts that you look to take on for a life time ...

Most important thing is the competency of the instructor and the club and not the style .

There are many good and many bad shotokan clubs ...just like any other style of martial arts , if you find a genuine and competent instructor in whatever ryu stick with him like glue !

[evergrey]

Well, if he wants budo and tradition as well as alive sparring, Kyokushin is a fine choice. Kickboxing is more a sport, yes.

Kyokushin is a traditional martial art, which focuses on all three Ks. Kihon, Kata, and Kumite. It's more about the kihon and kumite than it is about the kata, but the kata is still a very important element.

It doesn't have to be one extreme (no real contact or free flowing kumite) or the other (a fighting gym.)

[pers]

shotokan and kyukoshin have a different concept in fighting and self defence ,perhaps you should go on you tube and watch the best of the two styles closely and see if you can notice the difference and see which one apeals to you more .

In my experience and how we trained shotokan caters well for kumite , I can't speak for kyukoshin but in shotokan the way we trained free kumite started more seriousely at brown belt level and we got a lot of beating by dan grades when we were trying to spar with them .

shotokan is about being able to hit and avoid getting hit with body evasion and the ultimate aim is about one hit one kill ,from 3rd kyu to 8th dan this is what we try to improve on in our quest .

first from 9th kyu to 3rd kyu we learn and bulid strong techniques and as we are doing this we practice them in a basic form against a partner in 5 step 3 step and 1 step format and perhaps some free sparring at 5th and 4th kyu level .it was their job to block ,the only controlled part was the free shot counter attack by the defender ,otherwise you do your best to hit them . with this aproach both people benefit .

when we did these basic kumites we were taught to do our best to hit our opponent with our technique

Once reaching 3rd kyu brown belt is where more serious training starts ,the harder and better you have trained earlier on in your basics it will serve you better here . but there are no short cuts ,just like there no real get rich quick on the internet .

kyukoshin have a different aproach ,the body conditioning requierd for their type of kumite is very demanding as in their kumite you have to be able to stand up toe to toe and exchanges blows with your opponent until one drops , quite different from shotokan concept teaches you to avoid getting hit and finish the fight with one blow .

This is not to say one is better than the other ,it just that one methos suit some people better .kyukoshin ,Shitoryu ,wadoryu ,Gojuryu ,shotokan and the chinese systmes are all very good .