Best way to spar

[shinobitribe]

Hi guys,

I just wondering how you guys spar at your dojo? To elaborate, what intensity do you spar with?The dojo that I train at currently, we do one step sparring most of the time with semi contact. The school of thought at our dojo is that when you spar hard, your scared of getting hit and are more defensive and as a result you don't try all the techniques.

The dilemma that I am facing is that some guys at the dojo don't actually understand the principle behind it and start sparring hard which results in a stand off where both of us are more concerned with defence and dont try any techniques.

But on the other hand isnt it good to spar with intensity as that will help you learn to defend attacks that are close to what you might face in real life?

Basically how do I become good at sparring......

Thanks

[evergrey]

OSU,

In my dojo, we spar hard. Well, somewhere between 40% power to about 70% power- occasionally harder, but we don't want to break each other! We're a knockdown full contact style.

My experience is that getting hit hard encourages me to block, yes, but it also encourages me to fight back. I don't get upset or scared... I get used to taking hard strikes, and learn to not fear them. I can handle a lot more pain than I used to be able to, and it's much harder to make my body bruise.

I've also only a few times done one-step or one-move sparring. It's not terribly realistic compared to an actual fight or serious kumite. People know what to expect, and know when it's going to end. When someone is coming at you, relentless and unpredictable, when the sparring is more alive, then you really start to lean how to think and move in a situation where you have to fight.

If you never practice alive sparring, you're probably going to freeze up in a real fight. It's a totally different animal. Another thing to watch out for- it's a lot easier to have perfect kihon (technique) in a controlled, drill-like setting. In full-speed sparring with serious contact, everyone's technique falls apart a bit, especially at first. Most people find their technique falling apart quite a bit at first... that's why practice is so important.

When people from styles that never have alive sparring come to enter our knockdown tournaments, most of them tend to go down really fast. The force, the speed, the unpredictability, and the pain tend to be too much of a shock for them. Of course there are exceptions to the rules, always! But for the most part, YOU FIGHT HOW YOU TRAIN.

OSU!

[Wastelander]

Our youth students and new students spar both semi-contact continuous sparring and semi-contact point sparring. Eventually we move on to continuous sparring at around the same intensity level as Evergrey's dojo, although perhaps we tend to stay on the lower end of that range even when we go full speed--control is key. As for how to get better at sparring, you need to spar more. People can argue about what kind of sparring is best all day long but they all have a purpose and to neglect one type of sparring is to neglect a lesson you could be learning.

[MasterPain]

Very light sparring is great for trying new things. It allows you to try things out without fear of pain. That is valuable. I've done a lot of angle drills, what most call one steps, but always with the idea that later they would be used in a live match. The Dog Brothers have a saying, "If you see it taught, you see it fought." I stand by that.

Now there needs to be some common sense, here. Hard boxing should mean wrapping your hands and using big gloves. Tuite and Aiki type throws should be done with enough caution to not destroy your partner's joints. Groin kicks should be pulled and thown about half speed. Goggles should be worn when training finger jabs against an armed attacker. Fencing masks or cage headgear should be worn when someone is swinging a stick at you. Good shinguards are a great asset for muay Thai. No one should be injured, if everyone uses common sense.

Slow, easy, light contact is great for learning and developing technique. Most sparring should be fairly light. But harder contact keeps us honest. Therefore it also improves technique.

Here's a thought. If you never hit hard, then making contact at all becomes viewed as success. (like in point sparring) So you develop the skill of punching at full extension with no hip torque in a quick manner, making contact before anyone can make contact with you. You become very skilled at doing so, and become confident in your fighting prowess.....What you've actually done is trained yourself to be less effective than untrained teenagers in backyard fight clubs.

Now let's look at those teenagers in backyard fight clubs. They have no real technique. They're trying to copy the UFC fighters. They could do this stuff for 5 years and not be as good as someone with a year in a decent MMA gym. But, they have learned to be tough, if they manage not to be seriously injuried by one of the other numpties. (I like that word, thanks, UK.) They also have some understanding of res ipsa loquitur, and will pay attention to the guy with a year of training after he beats them up. I doubt that could be said of the no hard contact crowd, as they do not give the res a chance to loquitur.

[yamesu]

Some good points raised so far.

I too train in a "hard" style, and I can tell you that getting hit a couple of times makes you not want to be put into the same position again! Its a quick learning experience. But it certainly helps to pick more effective blocks and strikes against a partner going all out. One of the things that prevents us from doing nothing but stare each other out so-to-speak is that after 10 seconds or so of no contact, penalties can be awarded. You have to show fighting spirit.

In saying that, we do a lot of one and three step sparring too. All types of sparring have their merit. Its (like you stated) all down to levels of understanding what exactly it is you are training for in a given scenario.

[Dobbersky]

Strange that either Knock-Down KarateKa (Kyokushin, Ashihara or Enshin) have responded with the Full Contact Levels of continuous Sparring or the Hard Sparring of the Okinawan styles like Shuri Ryu or Goju Ryu (Note GoKanRyu are NON-Contact and not to be mistaken for GOJU Ryu/Kai).

In my school it goes from Shadow Sparring up to Full on for Dan Grades.

And my one rule:

"THE LOWER GRADE CONTROLS THE PACE"

In other words if the lower grade wants light contact then the higher grade will spar light contact.

But if the lower grade wants full contact the higher grade gives full contact.

If same grade them its a "gentleman's agreement".

[yamesu]

"THE LOWER GRADE CONTROLS THE PACE"

In other words if the lower grade wants light contact then the higher grade will spar light contact.

But if the lower grade wants full contact the higher grade gives full contact.

If same grade them its a "gentleman's agreement".

This is the way I have seen it done, and done it in every Kyokushin Dojo I have ever trained in (wel.. with a few minor exceptions). There is often one bad-egg who has something to prove.... they tend to quickly learn from others in house.

The tall poppy is the one that gets lopped - The nail that sticks out is the one that gets hammered.....

[hanshi9]

i've read all the comments on this topic and agree with all of you , except , the one factor that everyone has not mentioned is , what is the dojo? it's a place for learning how to defend your self. it's the sensei of the dojo who must guide each student along the path of sparring. the normal progression for kumite regardless of style or system is one step sparring into 3 step sparring increasing the power and speed as the student gains timing , strength , courage etc etc into free style kumite. it's now the responsibility of the SENSEI to stop each kumite match regardless of the level of the two students , instruct , correct and repeat the technique again so that the student understands where he or she is making mistakes.too often two students do kumite , beat the hell out of each other then sit down. if one student knocks down his fellow student , everyone laughs has a great time and they are ready for the next match. the dojo is a place where each student helps his brother in arms to be more proficient and not a place for competition it's a place of learning. we fight very hard to help each other prepare for the street.if a student keeps getting hit with , lets say a face punch and no one shows him why he is getting hit , where his weakness is , or where he drops his guard , he will continue to get hit. he's learned nothing. a good sensei will correct the students stance , kata , etc etc so doesn't stand to reason that the same should be done with kumite??so, all of the above falls back on the sensei and his yudansha to help you to become proficient in sparring.

[Wastelander]

i've read all the comments on this topic and agree with all of you , except , the one factor that everyone has not mentioned is , what is the dojo? it's a place for learning how to defend your self. it's the sensei of the dojo who must guide each student along the path of sparring. the normal progression for kumite regardless of style or system is one step sparring into 3 step sparring increasing the power and speed as the student gains timing , strength , courage etc etc into free style kumite. it's now the responsibility of the SENSEI to stop each kumite match regardless of the level of the two students , instruct , correct and repeat the technique again so that the student understands where he or she is making mistakes.too often two students do kumite , beat the hell out of each other then sit down. if one student knocks down his fellow student , everyone laughs has a great time and they are ready for the next match. the dojo is a place where each student helps his brother in arms to be more proficient and not a place for competition it's a place of learning. we fight very hard to help each other prepare for the street.if a student keeps getting hit with , lets say a face punch and no one shows him why he is getting hit , where his weakness is , or where he drops his guard , he will continue to get hit. he's learned nothing. a good sensei will correct the students stance , kata , etc etc so doesn't stand to reason that the same should be done with kumite??so, all of the above falls back on the sensei and his yudansha to help you to become proficient in sparring.

This is a valid point. I don't believe that anyone here disagrees with the fact that the sensei and yudansha of the dojo should be helping the students improve--the whole purpose of sparring, in general, is to improve your fighting skills in some way. I also don't think that anyone is advocating the idea that sparring should just be an all-out brawl with no form or control. Those of us who spar hard still take the time to work with our kohai to help them improve and work with our instructors and sempai so that we can improve, ourselves.

[bushido_man96]

We spar with moderate contact at times, but we have a fairly restrictive rule set, as well. Contact level doesn't get terribly high, though, but depending on who I am sparring with, things can get into that "fun" range from time to time.

MasterPain makes a lot of good points in his post. There are times for lighter sparring work, and more intense sparring work. Finding the happy medium and knowing when to do each will make for good training.