Real use for traditional weapon forms?

[tallgeese]

I think there is value in these things, just not combative.

There are pleanty of reasons one might decide to train traditional weapons. Cultural preservation, self betterment thru their discipline, or just becase they are cool. The beauty of ma's is that there is usually a niche for everyone and their goals.

We get to hasty sometimes to quatify why what we are doing transfers to combatives. It doesn't have to. For the last few hundred years the sword has had more to do with developing the self rather than fighting wars.

That's okay. We just have to acknowlege the intrensic value of the art for arts sake.

[bushido_man96]

If you learn the various traditional weapons you will find that that practice will transfer over to many every day objects because you are not only learning specific techniques with specific weapons, but you are teaching your mind and body to use a weapon, each of which has it's own way of working and being manipulated.

Sure, you may not have a jo/bo handy to defend with, but you might find something similar and your body and mind would already have the experiences of drills to know how to utilize it as a weaspon.

You may not have a tinfa handy when attacked by a baseball bat, but maybe you have a MagLite that can be used to block that bat from cracking your head open.

You may not have a set of nunchaku handy, but you know how to use a rope to block, a set of jumper cables to flick, or a towel to trap a weapon, leg or arm.

These are all very valid points, and I agree that a broomstick can become a staff weapon in a pinch. The major point I consider in training with more traditional weapons is doing so against another weapon, and not being constrained to merely whirling a weapon through the air in a form.

Really, you can find some value in every weapon, but some are much more valuable than others and your personal philosophy is going to have more impact on what weapons you train than anything.

I agree there is value in most any weapon you learn. However, I think some are more readily applicable than others.

[sensei8]

Traditional weapon Kata's and the like are important to developing and honing the needed skills to any said weapon, and that needed skill is CONTROL. One must control the weapon in and out while transitioning from one posture/stance to another.

Now, while XMA weapon Kata's are, imho, for flash, the practitioner wielding said weapon must STILL control the weapon. Peel away the XMA flash, the weapon within any said Kata is still a weapon. Worthy of respect.

Respect any said weapon before the weapon loses respect for the practitioner. Remember, the weapon and the body must become one, and to become one, control over said weapon is paramount.

Next time, try to watch a weapon Kata for the beauty of the weapon, and it's possible that you'll see the weapon and the practitioner are in deed...one!!

[sensei8]

I think there is value in these things, just not combative.

There are pleanty of reasons one might decide to train traditional weapons. Cultural preservation, self betterment thru their discipline, or just becase they are cool. The beauty of ma's is that there is usually a niche for everyone and their goals.

We get to hasty sometimes to quatify why what we are doing transfers to combatives. It doesn't have to. For the last few hundred years the sword has had more to do with developing the self rather than fighting wars.

That's okay. We just have to acknowlege the intrensic value of the art for arts sake.

Solid post Alex!!

[Liver Punch]

The guys I know on this forum would probably consider only the knife, "club", staff, machete, and gun to be "traditional". I'm guessing that most martial artists have the opposite viewpoint.

I'll concede that everyone else is right about this subject, however, I don't see why a common ground can't exist between both sides of the coin.

I try to make everything I do look pretty. It doesn't always work, but once I've achieved effective, I always try for fluid and graceful.

If I were part of a martial art that taught weapons that aren't typically used in modern settings, I'd start looking for the modern application of those skills. You guys have already mastered something that is difficult, and can make it pretty, so perhaps applying it to everyday items in the modern world would be a worthwhile endeavor.

Traditional staff work can be applied to baseball bats, metal pipes, pool sticks, etc.

I've seen Kukri Machetes with extreme blade angles that make them very much like a Kama.

A Meteor Hammer's techniques seem like they'd translate over to a normal chain no problem, or a chain with something as simple as a lock on the end(s).

I'm sure there's a million more, and when the zombie apocalypse happens, you may well find yourself trapped in the face of adversity with nothing to defend yourself with but a pair of makeshift nun chucks. Self defense is all about improvisation, and the greater your skill set and your ability to adapt it, the better off you are.

Edit: I'm challenging all of you traditional weapon guys to find a modern use for your traditional weapon skills. I think there's a use here that's mostly overlooked by people like me.

[Shotoseidoka]

Many do kama forms. Kama is a sickle, a common farming implement and something ubiquitous and beneath noticing in the possession of a peasant. A sickle in the hands of a laborer in the city these days is very unusual and noteworthy, and draws suspicion. Not useful to train anymore.

I guess you've never been in Okinawa...many Uchinan-chu have small private sugarcane farms and the harvest it using kama. Also almost any papa-san will have one or two kama in the bed of his truck...

Go to any D.I.Y store on Okinawa and you'll find a section of just kama of verious sizes, weights, and blade type.

me, I follow the saying "when in rome.."

[skullsplitter]

Thanks for all the replies folks. Some very useful info. I'd never considered the hammer/kama connection.

I really enjoy watching the weapons divisions at our open tournaments so now I'll be watching for everyday things that knowledge of the weapons can be used for.

[JusticeZero]

I guess you've never been in Okinawa...

No, I haven't been to Okinawa, and neither have the great majority of Karate practitioners who spend a lot of time studying kama forms. If you're in Alaska, it's important to train on ice and wearing winter clothing. If you're in Hawaii, it's much less valuable to spend time worrying about those things.