Increase of knife attacks locally, which defense tool?

[rhilllakefield]

Okay, this might be a long one.

There have been a few knife attacks lately in our home town, and someone actually dies from their injuries last night.

I'm essentially a life long martial artist, although I am quite realistic about knife defense and the odds of coming out with all limbs intact.

We are quite restricted in Canada with what we can carry, and I'm not sure another knife is the answer.

They are slow to draw if you don't have it in your hand already. They escalate a situation that might be solved with simply handing over a wallet. With someone intent on doing damage, they only result in two guys getting bloody, hospitalized....dead. They also pull your focus away from your attackers knife if you're trying to fish for it, and will also take away one hand used for grapling, striking etc......

My wife carries dog spray which is perfectly legal here. We live in the country with Coyotes, other dogs etc.... so its justified.

I've ordered a long paracord lanyard with a solid clip, with enough room for 6-7 keys on the end. I've been thinking distance, kicks, distraction etc... is the key to surivival, and not dragging the attacker into close range.

any thoughts?

Are their any arguments for knife vs. knife? deployment time etc.....

I like the keys, due to distance and the availability (you usually have them in your hand)

I just wanted to open this up and get some thoughts. Please, no commandos,

Ryan

[Montana]

Personally, I'd bring a gun to a knife fight...but hey, that's just me! lol

Forget tyhe keys..ineffective unless you're grappling, in which case you need to worry about the knife, not a set of keys and what to do with them.

In the local farm/ranch supply store they sell a rattan "bull cane" which is actually used to prod cows. Lightweight, incredibly strong, and best of all..LEGAL to carry! I keep on in all of my vehicles "just in case". I also faked a "limp" and took my cane thru the airport security a few years ago.

[rhilllakefield]

Thanks for the reply.

Unfortunately, no gun carry is legal in Canada.

Also, any type of cane, you'd have to be faking a limp, and I'm not sure I want to do that everywhere I go!

The keys used as a flail actually work if their swung properly. A 10" section of paracord with a mitt full of keys would be absolutely brutal across the face or arm.

Are there any arguments as to why a knife is the RIGHT weapon to carry against another knife? I've sort of ruled it out, after having thought about it. But it seems like the strongest weapon that is easy to carry, and is legal as long as you're smart with selection.

[Montana]

I wouldn't recommend trying to use a knife against another knife unless you know how to use one.

The first rule of knife defense is...If yoru attacker wants your wallet...GIVE HIM YOUR WALLET!!!

Speaking only for myself here, the system I train in practices defense against a knife frequently and I would be MUCH more comfortable going empty hand against a knife.

Most often times there is always something nearby that can be used as a weapon. If not something you can pick up, then a sign post or telephone pole that can be used to put between you and him. When he tries to come around it to get to you, that's when you strike, and strike HARD and with purpose.

You can't fool around withy someone that has an intent on killing you. Yes, you might get cut, even stabbed, but you need to go hard and fast with this attacker. If you have a coat/sweater you can wrap it around your leading arm to use as a shield.

You don't list the system you study...mind sharing that with us?

[rhilllakefield]

Hi Montana,

thanks for the reply.

I whole heartedly agree with what you've said. If someone wants my wallet and is armed, especially if Im with my wife.....Its all theirs.

Also, I agree with being unarmed vs. a knife as it frees up both of your hands, vs one of his.

I was looking at worst case scenario stuff, and wondering if anyone had any arguments for using a knife. A lot of guys like carrying them, but the reality is, there are so few times it would be a wise decision to draw it, it makes them one of the worst options out there.

Just my 2 cents, but you summed it up.

Also, I study Ishinryu Karate, not the Okinawan style but the British style. Its a hard style based on a blend of Shotokan, Kuokushin and Goju Ryu.

[MasterPain]

I will agree that not fighting is best when it's an option. But some keys on a string are best for amusing babies. A telephone pole was mentioned, use it to gain opportunity to draw a knife, since a gun is not an option.

[tallgeese]

I have to respectfully disagree with rd2022 with is assertion that both hands free are better to deal with the knife. Escalation of weaponry is a primary principle when confronted with armed violence. A weapon not only produces a certain mental effect on your attacker, but is a major force multiplier when it comes to putting hurt on the bad guy.

Let me back up and preface this with any weapon that you're gonna carry you need to: a) train with, and b) be willing to use against another human being.

If you can't do both then don't carry it. It will only get taken away and used against you. Bear in mind that this is a risk regardless. Train for that as well.

So, back to topic. A knife moves fast, and unlike a gun, has multiple surfaces that you have to worry about. When doing gun work, you have to worry about the barrel, and make sure it's not pointing at you. With a knife, you've got the entire length of the blade to be concerned with. Plus the serrations that are common near the tang on the blade side, and in some cases cutting edges on the spine of one kind or another. In addition to making a lot of areas to worry about, it makes gripping the weapon by a defender difficult at best.

Now, I will and have for a long time, conceded that when unarmed facing a knife using both of your hands to control his weapon hand is probably the best option you have. But this is a secondary option.

I'd rather have another weapon in my hand to meet it. If you deploy a knife or club (my Thagg nomenclature for a baton- expandable or otherwise, and what most Japanese arts call a hanbo) you have better options to counter with.

A knife of your own gives you the chance to cut the knife out of his by attacking the gripping hand. Do you run the same risk, sure, but that's why your going to train to increase your odds of being successful. Now, let's control the distance a bit (anther principle that's dear to me by the way). Let's use a club. Now I'm back a bit, and I get to smash his knuckles and attempt to release the weapon. Or kneecap him and gain even more distance by sprinting like mad.

Best case, I'd like a firearm in my hand, but the OP has certain regulations in place that make this impossible. Further, even it you're carrying one, be aware that it might not be instantly accessible and you might need and unarmed bridge to make that presentation happen.

Some sort of intermediate weapon is such a good idea that I'd use a rolled newspaper before going entirely unarmed.

[JusticeZero]

A cane might require a bit of a limp sometimes, but an umbrella is equivalent.

A tough jacket or equivalent seems useful against a knife, and you can always say you overdressed.

Then of course, there's the trusty 6+ D metal barrel flashlight.

[Liver Punch]

Caveman logic tells me that weapons are better than hands. Against a knife, my personal preference is a club - but, it's something I train with and are comfortable with. As far as local law and regulation is concerned, I've found a few viable options. They're all tools, and unless used as a weapon, they can probably be passed off as such, and carried in your car.

http://www.real-self-defense.com/unbreakable-umbrella.html

http://www.jr.com/maglite/pe/MGL_S6D016/

http://www.12volt-travel.com/19-wooden-tire-thumper-p-5995.html?zenid=c9f0b447d6055d85b29e30c887359a82

[tallgeese]

LP, on the Mag Lite note, I've always wanted to spot weld at tow hitch to the butt end of a D Cell Mag Lite. Can you image the blind them followed by the Hulk Smash end whipping in tactic?

I looked into having it built but a welder buddy of mine said the material at the end of the Mag wouldn't hold up to the process of making a tow hitch stay in place.

Well, I'll keep looking.