White, Brown, and Black!

[sensei8]

I voted "YES" , however, I'd rather we didn't even have a belt awarding methodology to indicate ranks, but, that was left up to those who came before me/us to decide.

[Lupin1]

I voted "no" although I'm leaning a bit closer to maybe. I like being able to tell almost exactly where someone is just by looking at their waist and at my old class the ranking process is slow enough that we didn't have the annoyance of having to shell out money for a new belt every three months. I think I might also get a little frustrated staying the same for so long (I've been training Isshinryu for 5 years and I'm still one shy of brown belt, and I think 5 years at white belt would be frustrating), but that might just be because I'm not used to it. I think White, Green, Brown, Black would be a lot more attractive to me.

[Wastelander]

I voted "no" although I'm leaning a bit closer to maybe. I like being able to tell almost exactly where someone is just by looking at their waist and at my old class the ranking process is slow enough that we didn't have the annoyance of having to shell out money for a new belt every three months. I think I might also get a little frustrated staying the same for so long (I've been training Isshinryu for 5 years and I'm still one shy of brown belt, and I think 5 years at white belt would be frustrating), but that might just be because I'm not used to it. I think White, Green, Brown, Black would be a lot more attractive to me.

I agree in the fact that I like being able to look at someone's belt and know what they should know, and spreading it out as far as white-brown-black would make that rather difficult. I have even known people who wanted to go back to white and black, only, which would make it even more difficult. When it was one person teaching just a handful of people that would be fine, but when you are teaching 30 to 50 different people a week it could become a problem.

[Jay]

I say none because I do not really like the belt system. Martial art is a process not an outcome. By having outcomes the student gets frustrated they are not progressing. When there is no objective measurement system for progression the student can't get as frustrated. Everyone is different some of us are more talented others not so much. I think the instructor should say when they feel the student has learned as much as they can from them and to go and find another teacher. I don't believe one person is the solution. Problem is in this day and age where clubs are run for business it won't happen.

[bushido_man96]

I voted maybe, because the belt doesn't mean as much to me as it once did. I'll be honest, when I started, I liked the idea of testing, moving up, and earning that next belt. It was motivational. Now, training itself is motivational, not the ranks.

[conrad665]

I voted "no" although I'm leaning a bit closer to maybe. I like being able to tell almost exactly where someone is just by looking at their waist and at my old class the ranking process is slow enough that we didn't have the annoyance of having to shell out money for a new belt every three months. I think I might also get a little frustrated staying the same for so long (I've been training Isshinryu for 5 years and I'm still one shy of brown belt, and I think 5 years at white belt would be frustrating), but that might just be because I'm not used to it. I think White, Green, Brown, Black would be a lot more attractive to me.

I agree with you, it would be really boring to stay in the same colour for so long. In my dojo, there are three levels of brown belt (I'm at the second) and even this makes me impatient. Maybe after a while, when I get wiser and more mature(in terms of karate) it may not matter like today.

[mindsedgeblade]

Maybe. Three seems to pare it down a bit too far, but certainly fewer belts than many places use would be better. I would say AT MOST 6. 4-5 strikes me as ideal. Just enough to tell what forms someone knows and approximately how long they've been training. White, couple intermediates, black. If it's more than the 4-5 years for 1st dan, you don't need to know.

My old school used 6- white, yellow, blue, green, red, black. White was basically no belt or uniform- just workout clothes and didn't last long. Black belts had embroidery, but usually no dan stripes.

The new school uses at least a dozen (common use, plus higher stuff). White, white stripe, white/orange, orange, orange/green, green/brown, brown, brown/red, red, red/blue, blue, black, black with dan stripes, black with red (master/teacher), red/white (grandmaster). Far, far too many.

[Zen Kamikaze]

I say none because I do not really like the belt system. Martial art is a process not an outcome. By having outcomes the student gets frustrated they are not progressing. When there is no objective measurement system for progression the student can't get as frustrated. Everyone is different some of us are more talented others not so much. I think the instructor should say when they feel the student has learned as much as they can from them and to go and find another teacher. I don't believe one person is the solution. Problem is in this day and age where clubs are run for business it won't happen.

I couldn't agree more. I'm not either a belt ranking fan. It's martial art loses her true essence in order to catch up a new rank and become a black belt ''master''. We see the tree everytime but we forget the forest. The only good for a belt is to keep tight this gi on you.

[ps1]

I voted yes. I am biased though. In Chuan Fa we had only 4 sashes (white green brown and black) and Aiki Ju Jitsu was exactly the same. Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu uses only 5.

I feel that the longer it takes to earn a rank, the less focus a person puts on earning a rank. In karate, there were tests every tree months. It seemed like all people did was just practice what they needed for the next test. But there was no true understanding of the material. Of course, that was the fault of their instructor...but that's another issue all together.

For example: I recently earned a Brown belt in BJJ. There were only vague requirements set forth for the test. So I took 1 month and practiced everything I wanted to demonstrate. That's one month out of the three years I spent at purple belt. The rest of the time was spent just trying to better understand the art. Now...there's a great deal of time before i will even have to think about my next rank. I am back to just trying to understand the art and bettering myself.

To me:

Fewer Ranks= more time to train

[DWx]

I said no but mainly because I'm cynical and don't think a lot of people would stick at it long enough if they didn't have a regular attainable goal, especially kids. It serves as motivation and provides short term goals. Obviously all of us who post on here have more than a casual interest in MAs and can appreciate that its not just about getting to the next level but for a lot of people it is. It isn't until several years down the line that they take a "proper" interest and some of them turn out to be really great martial artists and the next generation of teachers. By the time they've got a few years training under they're belt (excuse the pun ) they'll be at the advanced colour belt to 1st dan level where you tend to spend longer amounts of time. By then they've got both the technical foundation and actual drive to take a holistic approach to training. Until then its just learn a couple of kicks, punches, throws... not necessarily a system. Maybe it is a bit of a McDojo approach but I do like the idea of reeling in as many students as possible with superficial things like belts and then watch them develop into serious students and great fighters whilst weeding out the ones that really don't care in the long term.

I don't think a belt/curriculem based approach to teaching is all that bad either as long as there's no excessive testing fees and there is a reasonable amount of learning that has to be done for each. If blackbelt isn't really the ultimate goal, then who cares how many other belts your'e going through? As long as the focus isn't just on the next set of techniques to learn but on improving on what you're already done too. Even if you learnt how to side kick 5 belts ago, your side kick now should be markedly improved and be demonstrated at your test along with new materials. I really don't think there's anything wrong with a structured approach to training. I know as I was going up through the ranks it would be good to look at my current syllabus to know what new material I needed to be able to do but also to look through at all the past levels and ask myself "can I do that technique like a [next colour] belt would?"