Define EFFECTIVE!

[sojobo]

When I practice Iaido, I do so with focus and intent - and of course martial technique (no point otherwise) however these skills alone would not allow me to defend myself in a pub brawl (unless I had my sword with me lol). But that does not mean Iaido is not a martial art, because it is a specific martial skill that one has chosen to study.

I definitely view Iaido and Western Swordsmanship arts as historical Martial Arts. I do think that the concepts you learn in them can apply to present day, even if you only find a stick in your hands to defend yourself with. There are definitely better, more modern weapons with which to defend oneself with.

I would agree - although I am not sure quite how the Iai that I been taught would work out with a stick.

But, I can see perhaps how the principles of movement could be viewed as beneficial albeit from a educational viewpoint - in terms of engendering good focus and body mechanics etc.

No, because XMA has no basis in real martial technique (ancient or present day).

Ah, but it does. XMA techniques are based from many basic techniques and many basic kicks. They are just put in a different context.

Not sure - as a kick without combative intent or purpose is not a martial technique (irrespective of its tenuous origins) - it is just a movement and in the case of XMA - trained mostly for the judges and the crowd.

Sojobo

[bushido_man96]

I don't disagree with your last statement, but, if the practitioners didn't do traditional Karate before, they probably would have done the XMA competitions. Like I said, just a different context for the technique.

[sojobo]

Did you mean that they probably would NOT have done XMA?

[bushido_man96]

Did you mean that they probably would NOT have done XMA?

Yep, that's what I meant. Missed a key there, I think.

I guess for the sake of Sensei8's thread, we will have to call a truce - and anyway, maybe this sort of stuff is better realised in the dojo (or even better a cold beer after ).

Mmm, beer. Sounds good to me. When you comin' by?

[sensei8]

I knew that when I started this thread that there would be some difference from one style to another and from one practitioner to another. Whether one would agree with your definition or not wasn't important to this thread. No. What was important to this thread was to know what "YOUR" definition of EFFECTIVE was, and that alone.

[sojobo]

I don't disagree with your last statement, but, if the practitioners didn't do traditional Karate before, they probably would have done the XMA competitions. Like I said, just a different context for the technique.

That’s a very interesting statement. I have no real frame of reference as XMA is still very much in the minority here in the UK.

Isn't it likely though, that even if these XMA guys started in a "traditional" dojo - it (the Dojo) was probably one that leant away from the hard core traditional and more toward the sport / display stuff?

Either that or the clubs they trained with didn't have enough to keep them there for one reason or another. Isn't XMA very lucrative for some of these top players?

Sojobo

[bushido_man96]

I'm unsure of how lucrative XMA competition is, to be honest. I've never been into it. A local Karate school that holds an annual tournament does have open divisions for weapons forms that are XMA type, and I don't believe there is any money to be won.

As far as leaning away from traditional to something more flashy, I don't know if that's the case or not. Everyone has different goals, and many schools want to provide as many aspects as they can to bring in as many students as they can.

[MasterPain]

I knew that when I started this thread that there would be some difference from one style to another and from one practitioner to another. Whether one would agree with your definition or not wasn't important to this thread. No. What was important to this thread was to know what "YOUR" definition of EFFECTIVE was, and that alone.

Effective means I go home alive and well.

[sensei8]

I knew that when I started this thread that there would be some difference from one style to another and from one practitioner to another. Whether one would agree with your definition or not wasn't important to this thread. No. What was important to this thread was to know what "YOUR" definition of EFFECTIVE was, and that alone.

Effective means I go home alive and well.

Absolutely!

[bushido_man96]

When I practice Iaido, I do so with focus and intent - and of course martial technique (no point otherwise) however these skills alone would not allow me to defend myself in a pub brawl (unless I had my sword with me lol). But that does not mean Iaido is not a martial art, because it is a specific martial skill that one has chosen to study.

I definitely view Iaido and Western Swordsmanship arts as historical Martial Arts. I do think that the concepts you learn in them can apply to present day, even if you only find a stick in your hands to defend yourself with. There are definitely better, more modern weapons with which to defend oneself with.

I would agree - although I am not sure quite how the Iai that I been taught would work out with a stick.

But, I can see perhaps how the principles of movement could be viewed as beneficial albeit from a educational viewpoint - in terms of engendering good focus and body mechanics etc.

Yeah, Iai is pretty specialized, if I remember right, basically focused on a draw and single cut with the sword? Or something to that effect. But, I still think the principles and mechanics can effect how well you could club someone if you needed to, hehe...

In many of the Medieval European styles I've read up on, many of the techniques with the weapons correlate to each other. Many quarterstaff movements corespond to the movements and strikes of a sword, and transmit to other weapons as well. Its what made the systems so effective. Not all of them were exactly the same, but most of the concepts and mechanics transfered.