Is it realistic to train for multiple attackers?

[sensei8]

Is it realistic to train for multiple attackers? Yes, but only if you are already very competent at taking on one attacker. Lets take an example from outside the realm of fighting for a moment.

Imagine we are training someone for basketball. Do we teach them how to handle a double team before we are sure the kid has good ball handling skills? No, of course not. I'm not talking about passing the ball here, just how to attack the double team. Afterall, we can't pass off the fight. However, as the kid gets very good, we can teach them these skills. Now, let's look at the NBA. You can estimate the number of players who can effectively handle a double team on a consistent basis to be very small at best. Most of those guys are in the hall of fame. So, is it doable? Sure. Is it likely that every one who trains it will be good at it? No, not really. Of course, if you put even the worst NBA player against 2 high school players, he'll beat them every time. So there's a hierarchy of sorts. Unfortunately, we can't always choose our adversaries.

The same holds true for any skill. Fighting is no different. I've seen teachers making 9 year old green belts, who have very little dexterity, agility, kinesthetic awareness and skill, train against multiple attackers. All that came out of it is that the kid looked really sloppy. Is that realistic? In my opinion, no. The kid would get himself hurt trying this against a few bullies, let alone a more dangerous encounter.

I believe our time is better spent learning to deal with one attacker. Once we are exceptional at that skill, moving on to multiple attackers is something to train from time to time. Just hope that neither attacker has much fighting experience, or you may be in alot of trouble.

SOLID post!!

[JiuJitsuNation]

Is it realistic to train for multiple attackers? Yes, but only if you are already very competent at taking on one attacker. Lets take an example from outside the realm of fighting for a moment.

Imagine we are training someone for basketball. Do we teach them how to handle a double team before we are sure the kid has good ball handling skills? No, of course not. I'm not talking about passing the ball here, just how to attack the double team. Afterall, we can't pass off the fight. However, as the kid gets very good, we can teach them these skills. Now, let's look at the NBA. You can estimate the number of players who can effectively handle a double team on a consistent basis to be very small at best. Most of those guys are in the hall of fame. So, is it doable? Sure. Is it likely that every one who trains it will be good at it? No, not really. Of course, if you put even the worst NBA player against 2 high school players, he'll beat them every time. So there's a hierarchy of sorts. Unfortunately, we can't always choose our adversaries.

The same holds true for any skill. Fighting is no different. I've seen teachers making 9 year old green belts, who have very little dexterity, agility, kinesthetic awareness and skill, train against multiple attackers. All that came out of it is that the kid looked really sloppy. Is that realistic? In my opinion, no. The kid would get himself hurt trying this against a few bullies, let alone a more dangerous encounter.

I believe our time is better spent learning to deal with one attacker. Once we are exceptional at that skill, moving on to multiple attackers is something to train from time to time. Just hope that neither attacker has much fighting experience, or you may be in alot of trouble.

SOLID post!!

I second that!

[bushido_man96]

I think one of the main problems is that people want to be trained to take one attacker down, and then move on to eliminating the next attacker, and then the next, until all those guys who jumped you at once are down and you stand victorious. In reality, it usually isn't going to work that way. The important steps that need to be taught are how to make space and line the attackers up so they aren't all taking shots at you simultaneously, perhaps eliminating the initial attacker, and then using that opportunity to make the hasty retreat. Its all about setting the right goals, and then setting training objectives to meet those goals.

[JiuJitsuNation]

I think one of the main problems is that people want to be trained to take one attacker down, and then move on to eliminating the next attacker, and then the next, until all those guys who jumped you at once are down and you stand victorious. In reality, it usually isn't going to work that way. The important steps that need to be taught are how to make space and line the attackers up so they aren't all taking shots at you simultaneously, perhaps eliminating the initial attacker, and then using that opportunity to make the hasty retreat. Its all about setting the right goals, and then setting training objectives to meet those goals.

YEZZIR!!!

[BladeSmartNY]

It all depends on the art and the skill level of the practitioner. The Filipino Martial Arts were designed to fight 3 people with 3 hits. It's effective because the hits are all aligned to get on the inside of your opponent and end a fight.

Multiple opponents only happens in the street. Now if you consider that most people are training for 1on1 competitions such as kickboxing, jiu jitsu, karate, TKD, etc you will realize that most martial artists aren't preparing for multiple attackers.

[bushido_man96]

I'm not so sure its the style that is being trained in, but rather its important that the stylist evaluates the techniques they know, and determine the proper strategy and tactics to use from what they know when facing multiple opponents.

I do agree with you that many styles do concern themselves more with training one-on-one, and not multiples.

I also think that there is a different mindset to multiple opponent training. I don't think its as realistic to train multiples with the mindset of finishing them off, like it would be in one-on-one competition. Instead, it would be more ideal to train to get as many of the opponents in a line as possible, using tactics to make space, committing attacks to the first/closest in line in a very violent and determined manner, and then using your escape route you've been searching for all along.

[sensei8]

Multiple attackers...to train in or not?! Why not, as long as its done as realistic as possible. Be as prepared as one can be. Remember, fighting multiple attackers in real life is not the same as a Kung Fu movie or a MA demo...one attacker at a time.

[albeaver89]

If you are not training for multiply attackers you are not using martial arts correctly. No one is going to go one on one anymore, there are always multiply ppl and even if there is not youve been training with like ten ppl attacking you so it should be cake. Always make training harder then any real life situation.

[bushido_man96]

Another issue to consider is training with multiple people on your side. I don't know if you would want to call this "team fighting" or not, but I have seen where in the example of law enforcement scenarios it would be beneficial to know what one should do to help another out and not be counterproductive in the scenario.

[tallgeese]

bushidoman, you raise a great point here. It's one we've just started to address. As LE, we travel in packs, it's how we work. We did a Use of Force review at the beginning of the year to work on tweaking our program, what we found is what we've intuitively said for years- we arrest people with more than one person at a time.

In fact, when we interviewed everyone who'd used force in 2010, we found that one common complaint was that we spent more time fighting each other for control of a subject than we spent fighting the subject. So, we stated working on that rather than just working towards taking people into custody one on one.

It's an example of how we really have to examine what we're doing vs. what we need to be doing and adjusting training from there.