Sparred Tonight

[Martialart]

I'd be shocked if I were you. Granted my experience is only limited to only one dojo and a hand full of black belts, but I could never manhandle ANY of the BBs at my school. I’m no tough-guy but I’ve got a good reach, long legs and I’m willing to take a punch to give one. I’ve turned it up a notch a few times to see if I could handle what they had… very quickly the difference in rank was apparent. I have a lot to learn and I’m glad I’m surrounded by BBs that are qualified to teach me.

I am a little shocked. But it is what it is. I feel a bit sorry for them, really. Because I wonder if they could even take care of themselves against a bully in school. And if a black belt won't get you at least that far...

Nonetheless, I like what Bushido-man says. Perhaps, I can help them a bit.

And they can help me, too, because I need the stamina. They seem to have that. So maybe I can give what I have, and they can give what they have to the benefit of us all. We'll see, I suppose.

[algernon]

Were the black belts that you sparred with aware of your prior experience? If they weren't, they may have been deliberately letting you in. It is normal for experienced students (especially black belts) to use a sparring session as a teaching tool for lower grades, which does involve creating some obvious openings for the student to spot.

The next time you spar, let them know that you have experience, and that you would like a challenge.

If it becomes certain that the black belts at your school are really that deficient, then you might want to consider finding a better school. It is unlikely that a lone white belt sparring hard will have a significant impact on the way that the school as a whole trains. You have said that you don't mind training in a "McDojo," but you might want to reevaluate whether the school is able to meet your needs. You have said that the school is well-equipped, but how do you value that compared to a school that is more capable of developing your skills? (Not rhetorical! )

[Martialart]

Were the black belts that you sparred with aware of your prior experience? If they weren't, they may have been deliberately letting you in. It is normal for experienced students (especially black belts) to use a sparring session as a teaching tool for lower grades, which does involve creating some obvious openings for the student to spot.

That could be it, but I didn't get that impression.

The next time you spar, let them know that you have experience, and that you would like a challenge.

I can only imagine how insulting that would be if in fact they really are doing their best. I'd rather they just whopped me upside the head if they can.

If it becomes certain that the black belts at your school are really that deficient, then you might want to consider finding a better school.

There are none. I mean, there's other TKD Plus schools in the area, but they all follow the same ITA curriculum. And like I said, I need the stamina training; I don't really need to learn to spar better. I don't think so, anyway. I need more flexibility and stamina so I can do more of what I want to do, but I don't really need a challenge per se.

I'll spar with those guys. I don't have a problem with that. I just know now that I might have to take some care with some of them--as compared to being like a newbie who wants to do everything they can to prove something.

It is unlikely that a lone white belt sparring hard will have a significant impact on the way that the school as a whole trains.

We're green now. That's how we ended up sparring. You have to be green to spar. But I agree, we won't have a significant impact on how the school trains. We never will, actually. The ITA really sets the curicculum.

You have said that you don't mind training in a "McDojo," but you might want to reevaluate whether the school is able to meet your needs. You have said that the school is well-equipped, but how do you value that compared to a school that is more capable of developing your skills?

Well, really, when I think about it, the school is fine. It's like I said earlier, they teach you how to spar, and we spar every class. I can't fault the school for that. And they talk tough standards, I just don't know where all these 2nd and 3rd dans came from. Maybe when they were first starting the school they had to do whatever they could to keep students coming. Acutally, they seem to nit pick me and my wife a little more than I think they should--compared to what we see around us. But maybe they're trying to change. Maybe that starts with us.

In fact, that night the instructor (one of the owners/masters) was cracking the whip pretty hard--surprisingly. I just hope it continues. I would imagine a lot of those black belts don't. I guess we'll see.

[ninjanurse]

We're green now. That's how we ended up sparring. You have to be green to spar. But I agree, we won't have a significant impact on how the school trains. We never will, actually. The ITA really sets the curicculum.

The curriculum does not dictate HOW you train...only WHAT & WHEN you train. Eventually those around you will rise to the same expectations you hold for yourself.

[Chitsu]

@Martialart:-

Mr Spanton would be proud

Chitsu

I met Pete Spanton once at an event in London. He seemed like a really nice man, and he said a few words to me. I think he signed a book I bought there on Higashi forms. He was very approachable. Tough, but not a tough-guy if you know what I mean.

Of course this was back in the mid 1980's. I trained in Swindon, Wiltshire.

Are you connected with Higashi at all?

No, I am a JKF Wadokai fella, but Wado (and traditional Karate as a whole) in the UK is fairly well connected so of course I know of Mr Spanton and his Higashi group.

Spanton was one of the UK's very first dan grades under the Suzuki regime, so his name is up there, however he (like many others) broke away from the Wado fould fairly early on and he has changed things quite a bit as far as I can see.

As you say Wado based rather than Wado itself.

I know of several ex Higashi guys and am aware of his reputation for "beasting" his students. He trains hard and he trains his people hard.

Nothing wrong with that of course.

Chitsu

[Martialart]

@Martialart:-

Mr Spanton would be proud

Chitsu

I met Pete Spanton once at an event in London. He seemed like a really nice man, and he said a few words to me. I think he signed a book I bought there on Higashi forms. He was very approachable. Tough, but not a tough-guy if you know what I mean.

Of course this was back in the mid 1980's. I trained in Swindon, Wiltshire.

Are you connected with Higashi at all?

No, I am a JKF Wadokai fella, but Wado (and traditional Karate as a whole) in the UK is fairly well connected so of course I know of Mr Spanton and his Higashi group.

Spanton was one of the UK's very first dan grades under the Suzuki regime, so his name is up there, however he (like many others) broke away from the Wado fould fairly early on and he has changed things quite a bit as far as I can see.

As you say Wado based rather than Wado itself.

I know of several ex Higashi guys and am aware of his reputation for "beasting" his students. He trains hard and he trains his people hard.

Nothing wrong with that of course.

Chitsu

Yeah, I left Higashi and ended up training with a traditional Wado-Ryu instructor, but the sparring in Higashi really stuck with me once I got it. And before Higashi, I was a whimp. Heck, in Higashi I was whimp!

I would have stuck with it, but the instructor I had was an immature 30-ish type who was just starting his own school in it. He was the type who talked about how great he was and flirted with the girls in the class, and we trained at this stupid free "community center" which was really more like a big shack.

I've looked for this guy's picture throughhout the Higashi web sites and I can't find him. I don't know what happened to him. When you pull up Swindon Higashi, it's other instructors that I knew of back then, but not him. Who knows, maybe they weeded him out or maybe he just quit. It has been 25 years.

But what I experienced in Higashi by going to the tournaments (to watch) and sparring in class really was a defining moment for me.

In fact, I have to tell this story: I had a girlfriend back then, and she had an ex-boyfriend who she said was really tough and into kung-fu and nunchucks. And I was still in my whimp phase of life, so I was actually quite scared of this guy, even though I had never seen him. Nonetheless, in my mind, he was Bruce Lee.

We broke up, eventually, she went back to him. And that drove me crazy. Yet, I still had never seen the guy. But being the young man I was, I got into martial arts: I bought a book, then I started in this huge Taekwondo class at some rec center (joke), then I got into Higashi by chance. And of course, I bought nunchucks and after beating myself senseless with them over and over, I actually became quite good at them (double nunchucks, too).

So, six months later, after some other break-up with someone else, I'm obsessively driving by her house (as I had done in secret many times) and I see him. And he's this little guy. And I know it's him because he's walking from her house and he's got those black kung-fu slippers on. And maybe I would have been wrong, but I just knew at that time I could pummel him without a second thought. I mean I had come to learn that it's no big deal to get hit; it's no big deal to counter and punch; I could kick fast and high in combination, and I no longer cared if I got beat (because I got beat every day in class). This guy wouldn't have stood a chance.

Given what I had been through in Higashi, and practicing nunchucks with this demon in my mind the whole time, I saw him for the first time, and felt sorry for him. Because she was no good--not for me, and probably not for him either, and there was no way I was going to beat up on this smaller opponent who wouldn't have even been in my weight class. So I drove on by and never drove by her house again (She lived in Devizes)

That's why sparring in Higashi stayed with me all these years. I used it to beat a demon in my mind (and got seriously tough in the process), and then the demon evaporated.

True story.

Edited May 15, 2010 by Martialart

[Martialart]

Eventually those around you will rise to the same expectations you hold for yourself.

Those are some good words. Thanks, Ninjanurse.

P.S. Any chance you are a nurse?

[Chitsu]

Nice story Martialart.

What made you give up traditional Wado.

Chitsu

[DWx]

It's like I said earlier, they teach you how to spar, and we spar every class. I can't fault the school for that.

Making you spar and teaching you to spar and two different things. If all they are doing are telling you those 4 pointers you mentioned in your op, that's not teaching you to spar. That's telling you those 4 pointers. Teaching you to spar is drills, pad work, instructor's sparring students and kicking the student's butts until they can kick yours back. Teaching someone to spar is giving them combinations that work for their body type and letting them develop them. You can't just simply say "spar" and expect everyone to be good at it. Those with natural ability might develop it but most people will just flounder around like the blackbelts you described.

If you want them to be better maybe you should start leading by example. I find nothing works better for getting people to keep their guard up than clocking them round the head with a kick or backfist or whatever. They learn fast that way.

[Martialart]

Nice story Martialart.

What made you give up traditional Wado.

Chitsu

I think that's when I first started taking college classes. I didn't get into martial arts again until 1998 in Colorado Springs. The most professional place to train there was at Sang Lee's US Taekwondo Academy. And it was close to where we lived.

I would quit the school I'm at now if there was a decent Wado-Ryu school around where I live now, but there isn't. Wado-Ryu will always be my first love, but traditional Taekwondo (ITF-style) is a suitable substitute in my opinion.

How 'bout you?