Full contact point sparring in shotokan karate

[Soheir]

The acquisition of Kumite skills (and therefore doing well in competitions) is a by-product of good karate training imo - and should not be viewed as the "aspirational" end result.

You mean, that is your opinion? But, in any Martial Art, that has kumite in it, I don't think it's just a by-product. It is a part of that style, and you can't just take it away. Which almost makes it a big part of the style and its history/philosophy.

[Chitsu]

The acquisition of Kumite skills (and therefore doing well in competitions) is a by-product of good karate training imo - and should not be viewed as the "aspirational" end result.

You mean, that is your opinion? But, in any Martial Art, that has kumite in it, I don't think it's just a by-product. It is a part of that style, and you can't just take it away. Which almost makes it a big part of the style and its history/philosophy.

Yes - as I said "imo".

I think however it's very important to draw a line under the difference between arts like Shotokan and Kyokushin.

Neither is better, but Shoto - with its “precepts” in "budo" does not lend it's self so readily to Kumite as "sport" perhaps.

Kumite’s fine if that’s your bag, but of course there is a lot more to Karate than fighting.

Chitsu

[Soheir]

Yes - as I said "imo".

I think however it's very important to draw a line under the difference between arts like Shotokan and Kyokushin.

Neither is better, but Shoto - with its “precepts” in "budo" does not lend it's self so readily to Kumite as "sport" perhaps.

Kumite’s fine if that’s your bag, but of course there is a lot more to Karate than fighting.

Chitsu

I understand. Not the main point, still there...

There is no need for shotokan to be same as other Karate styles, which have different kind of training methods. If you like it it's fine. What does anyone loose on the point that Shotokan has no full contact kumite, 'Cause if somebody doesn't like it, there is planty of styles to pick from.

[explosive_power]

If they did that and stuck to their pursuit of one-strike power it would become a very small community.

why is that sir?

[still kicking]

e_p, I think todome means because they'd all be dead.

In my style, Shito-ryu, we spar medium contact, similar to many Shotokan schools, I think. Whether or not this will be useful in a "real fight" I don't know. My opinion/assumption/hope is that combining this type of practice with use of full power against the bags, and developing control over how much power you use in each situation, will result in some kind of effective response if needed in a self defense situation. Bottom line, knock wood, I've never been in a "real fight", and hope I never am. I enjoy the budo aspects of karate very much, and do think being able to "fight" is integral to it. Maybe if I sparred full contact regularly I would be better able to defend myself, but it seems paradoxical to me. I am interested in defending myself so I don't get hurt, but sparring full contact multiple times a week pretty much guarantees I will be hurt! Plus, it would be difficult to explain all the signs of battering at work. As Sensei8 says, nothing will please everyone, so it's a good thing there are many styles to choose from.

I just can't resist saying... that saying about pleasing everyone really cracked my up, and reminded my of a kids' program I used to watch "long ago" -- I don't remember which one. It always ended with this saying... "You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can't fool mom!"

[todome]

e_p, I think todome means because they'd all be dead.

Pretty much, yeah. Going full contact would mean abandoning either the pursuit of lethal force or all respect for human life.

[bushido_man96]

It is possible to up the contact levels in sparring and not get hurt every day. Using the proper safety equipment can help with this.

As far as Shotokan gaining more respect if they make the contact harder, may be true. It may not, as well. I imagine that there are some Shotokan gyms out there that do some harder contact sparring. I do think that it would be a more convincing experience to some as to what the contact can actually make one feel like when fighting, and it would not be a bad experience. But, whether or not it ever changes, we'll have to see.