Grappling question... I'm out weighed!!!

[GeoGiant]

One of the black belts at my school has been offering a MMA class. So once or twice a week (its offered 2 times a week) I show up and workout. The class is so new that I'm one of the more advanced students... Ok, I'm not really advanced i just have more of the terminology memorized.

Most of the drills we do are very basic and our focus more on strength, conditioning and endurance. One of the drills we do is 2 people stand and face each other with person A putting his hands on top of person B's shoulders & vice-versa. Then the instructor yells go and we try to hook our arms under the persons arms, go for the take down, then try to gain an advantage on the floor. No punches or kicks are thrown. The instructor stops the drill when both people reach a point where no tactical advantage is being gained (ie. interlocked on the floor) or someone taps out due to an arm bar or choke (those are the only things we have drilled on at this point).

My issue is - I'm 6'4" (about 2 meters) & 185 lbs (about 13 stone) and I'm up against a guy that is 6' & 260 lbs. I have yet to find a way to gain a tactical advantage. Now common sense says that he will win every time, assuming we have a similar skill set. i never wrestled before so this idea of grappling is foreign to me however I would assume that there are methods for me to deal with my weight disadvantage... am I correct?

Is anyone aware of a technique or move that I could use in the drill I previously explained to get behind this guy so i can choke him out (not literally)? Any wrestlers out there?

[joesteph]

I can't claim to have the MMA experience others have in the forums, GeoGiant, but for a while, my Soo Bahk Do teacher was having adults do an intro to grappling to experience it and see if we had an interest. (The kids' classes loved it; the adult classes didn't go for it.)

She demonstrated with a guest student from another dojang, and we started on our knees, grabbing each other's dobok jackets. When she gave the go, we were to get the other guy on his back or face.

My friend/partner weighed 225lbs to my 170. (I'm back to 170lbs again, keeping my New Year's resolution. ) That 55lb difference gave him an advantage as my technique gave way to his kind of plopping down on me. But after two losses, I realized that his doing that was a weakness; I pulled him on the third match, and he went right down in front of me, so I plopped down on top of him and pressed down.

I'm not sure what your strategy is, and I don't know if it'll work with a standing opponent, but that's what I did--the unexpected--and it worked.

[tallgeese]

That's a big question, with alot of answers. Most are such that you'll need to spend lots of time drilling.

First off, let's face it, weight is an advantage. Especially if it's well conditioned muscle and not dead fat weight. That does not mean it's supreme, just that's it an advantage in the realm of grappling arts. It's something else that your technique will have to get refined enough to nullify or overcome.

Next up, I'm kind of having a tough time putting the drill together you're talking about. Do you work for double unders? Or is it more of a pummeling action once it is started? Is it simply a start point for open takedown efforts. Maybe a bit more clarification on the process of the drill as well as the intent and tools to be worked would be helpful, for me at least, in offering up advice.

With that in mind, there are some things to keep in mind when trying to get superior position on your partner. Popping and arm high on him might allow you to bob under and move to his back to execute a takedown from there. This becomes less and less functional the higher the skill of your partner.

A better option is working an arm drag to make him cross his own center line. This can often open up an avenue to his side and back, allowing numerous takedowns. Not to mention you can stack the arm drag in conjunction with just about anything.

Lastly, one of the mistakes I see newish people make on bigger guys is working their upper body too much on takedowns. It's much easier to attack the bigger guy lower, say with a double leg. It's easier to make something happen here by cutting angles than fighting a big amount of upper body strength.

That's just my two cents. But again, throw us a breakdown and guidelines of the drill and we can look at it specifically.

[Toptomcat]

I'm having difficulty understanding exactly what the drill is, too. Is it that you pummel for a while, then go for whatever sort of takedown you can, with wrestling for position to follow with a bit of sub work?

I can tell you that from a judo standpoint the classic answer for tall people having difficulty with shorter, stockier ones is foot sweeps, foot sweeps, foot sweeps.

[GeoGiant]

Ok, let me try to explain this better.

2 people line up facing each other. Each person fully extends their arms so their arms are parallel with the floor and their hands are on the persons shoulders.

The instructor yells go & each person trys to hook their arms under the other persons arms... almost like a hug position. Both people try not to let the other person take them down. Because the two people are so close to each other a take down seems to always happen. After people are on the ground, each struggles for a tactical advantage.

That make sense?

[ps1]

The sprawl is your friend. Don't let him get the underhooks. If/ when he gets the double under, drive his chin away from you and attempt to get one or both on him. Also, learn to lower your level. Don't expect to stand straight up and be able to beat him.

[GeoGiant]

The sprawl is your friend. Don't let him get the underhooks. If/ when he gets the double under, drive his chin away from you and attempt to get one or both on him. Also, learn to lower your level. Don't expect to stand straight up and be able to beat him.

When I occasionally get the hooks under him i never feel like he is off balance. If get the hooks and I try to put my leg behind his for a trip but I don't seem to be able to get the momentum to drive him back. Same situation, I tried turn to the side for a hip toss and ended up pulling most of the muscles in my lower back. Same situation, I tried to pull him forward with the idea of a chest to chest body slam (I know, I know) and he ended up landing on top of me.

Any suggestions?

[Toptomcat]

Hip tosses will always be out of the question without a significant difference in skill against someone who's shorter and heavier than you are, because to do them properly you need to get your hips lower than his- and his hips start lower than yours. Look into some judo foot sweeps, particularly osoto gari and sasae tsurikomi ashi.

[tallgeese]

So are any takedowns on for the drill? Can you switch your arm positions once the drill is running?

[GeoGiant]

So are any takedowns on for the drill? Can you switch your arm positions once the drill is running?

You can switch arm position after the drill starts - its on then! I think the idea of the drill is to get everyone used to working in close quarters where kicking and punching may not be an option. The drill gives me a better idea of where to put my feet and how to use my body to counteract anothers movements without going off balance. Against someone my own size or weight, I do okay but this bigger guy (who i like a lot) is killing me.

After some recommendations i got here I think i will try to go after his legs.