American Masters

[quinteros1963]

I am surprised to find out that several of the early pioneers of karate became so highly ranked in such a short time. I will not use names as I dont want to seem offensive to any particular styles.

5th degree in 8 yrs

Black Belt in 1.5 yrs and coming home to America a sensie

naming self 10th dan

peers awarding rank to one another up to 10th dan

Forming own association and becoming a self made 10 dan

All have gone on to be very succesful, but I am surprised to find out some of these things.

[foxriverselfdefense]

Yes it is very disappointing the way some of the arts have been manipulated.

For a fee you can even find yourself in the martial arts hall of fame..LOL

[Montana]

Since the mid 1970's there have been more "masters" of the martial arts in ANY single major American city (New York, LA, Chicago, etc) than there are in the entire orient!

Bunch of bunk if you ask me. That's one reason I like the art I'm in so much...very little of that sort of thing going on.

[Shizentai]

I suppose that just goes to show, ranks and belts only have so much meaning for any karate-ka. Put them on too high a pedestal and you're bound to be disappointed.

I know it's not karate, but here is a nice snipit of the converse to this over-ranking dilemma, the way a good high-rank test should be in my opinion:

[ninjanurse]

Shizentai-thanks for the great link. I really enjoyed it!

[mudansha]

Why do you think the Japanese laugh at our black belts? At my dojo, it takes 6-7 years to get a shodan. I go to tournaments where I am being judged by a TKD black belt that has been practicing for 1.5 years. I have been in for 4 but I am not allowed to judge because I am only 4th Kyu.

The other trend is for someone to take a traditional art like Shotokan or Goju for 7-8 years and then call himself a master and start his own "style" that "combines his extensive experience". It's a bunch of crap.

[Jeffrey]

Not to mention the huge amount of Mcdojo's that pop up. These self proclaimed masters of this and that are what really get to me. They take a blend of a few arts and put it all together and call it Temple Kung Fu or something. Yes I was a victim of this for a few months before I wised up and join a real school.

Didn't take long to figuer out.

[quinteros1963]

One of my instructors once told me to observe a dojo before you even try a training session. Look at the instructor, but more importantly, look at his people/students. You can tell a tree by the fruit it bears! The point of the thread, however is that some of the early American Masters of karate had limited exposure to the arts, yet came back to the US as "Masters".

[sensei8]

One of my instructors once told me to observe a dojo before you even try a training session. Look at the instructor, but more importantly, look at his people/students. You can tell a tree by the fruit it bears! The point of the thread, however is that some of the early American Masters of karate had limited exposure to the arts, yet came back to the US as "Masters."

I believe that this was happening back then because of the very extremely limited knowledge of Americans about the Martial Arts, including rank/titles. An unknowing American population was very naive about things like this and were quick to believe rank/title from those who perpetrated such things.

Oh what a tangled web...

[Fearun9033]

That is deplorable. I don't know if this is true, but my sensei told me that Dans above the 4th are mostly ceremonial in nature because all have similar skill levels by then. There are very very very few 8th and 10 dans in Japan.

when I hear "self-proclaimed/appointed", I don't know if I should pity these people or be angry.