Gender Issue

[DeeLovesKarate]

 

From the intro. page, I now feel welcome enough to ask a tough question. I recently went in an Aol standard MA post board. In a post titled " Am I the only 1." A female martial artists asked if she was the only female who loved martial arts and boxing. One person replied by using on of those oh-so-irritating Bruce Lee quotes. The post said " According to Bruce Lee, girls shouldn't be in Martial Arts. He said, " There is not an art stong enough to defend a women against a 300 lb. man." This angered me. I have been a Martial artist in two arts for 2 years and one month. I show talent in the martial arts, along with all of the young women at my school. Why is it that I am still treated, by people who hear of my martial arts training, as an inferior because of my gender? Do these people believe that reading Bruce Lee books and watching his movies is better than actual Martial Arts training and that thier ignorance is superior to my knowledge because I am a women?? Any responses?? Don't be shy. I can't be the only one who feels that this ignorance must stop??

 

Please reply,

 

My love to the M.A.'s,

 

Dee

 

 

[karatekid1975]

Hiya, Dee. I'm with ya, gal. I'm also female, and I've been also training for two years in two arts. I haven't come across "gender" issues yet, but I know I did when I was a drummer. I always heard, "Girls can't play drums". I know it's the same in MA somewhere. It does piss me off, but I learned not to let it bother me. Some guys are affraid a female will show them up (sorry guys, but some men are like that ). They have to learn that this is not the "old fashion days" anymore.

 

 

[KenpoChick87120]

I totaly feel for ya! I get that all the time, honestly one jerk even asked me "your a pink glitter belt then, right?" But when it comes down to it, I know I can defend myself or at least have an advantage... its all good

 

 

[G95champ]

We'll to say MA don't work for a girl is like saying they don't work for non Japanese. Completely stupid argument.

 

I will agree that because women are more ofter smaller and weaker than men it would be harder for them than say the avg. guy. But a woman with MA training IMO has a better chance than the avg. guy without. A good swift kick in the groin and a Tiger Claw can do much more damage than a reverse punch and uppercut.

 

When I went to college on of my history professors (Judy Doyle) was also in our karate class. She was the co-instructor before me. She was a 3rd Dan and was bad. She could hold her own with any man IMO.

 

Not many girls are going to hop in the ring and go 20mins with Ken Shamrock in a NHB fight but who is? I teach womens SD all the time I have had a girl break as many as 4 boards. So to say they can not stack up to men is completely stupid.

 

But stupid people say stupid things.

 

 

[rabid hamster]

Stuff like that really makes me mad. And are you serious Bruce Lee thought girls shouldn't be in martial arts? Well if this is true, I have lost respect for that guy.

[Bon]

A lot of the girls out there who take some form of martial arts don't appear to be capable of defending themsevles. I'm talking about the ones who are really akward in sparring, just stand there, don't hit anyone and if they do, it's so light, it's like a fly landing on you.. However, I met one chick who I'd put my money on to drop a guy any day!

 

 

[Taikudo-ka]

Hi Dee. Glad to hear you love karate!

 

With Bruce's quote - "There is not an art stong enough to defend a women against a 300 lb. man." I don't think he is saying women shouldn't do martial arts. Even his wife was originally a student at his kwoon. His point is one of realism, balance. Martial arts are great for women, HOWEVER, you should realize that a few karate or kung fu lessons will not give a slender 120 lb. women some magical guarantee of victory against a huge hulking 300 lb. guy brimming with aggression.

 

The same problem actually applies to guys as well. It's just more obvious with women because they are on average smaller and less aggressive. All the more reason to train even harder. Hard work and realism, no magic bullets - that's all Bruce is getting at. Notice he says "there is not an art strong enough...", NOT "there is not a woman strong enough...". Really its a jab at the old "my art is better than yours" argument, and he's basically saying that the artist is more important. No one STYLE will give you a magical advantage that lets you defy physics and perform superhuman feats. That is what he means by "there is not an art strong enough...".

 

I have noticed the phenomenon Bon talks about. A fair proportion (NOT all) of women who seem to either not understand the physics of punching, or if they do are simply unwilling to hit hard. I think it's a social conditioning thing, like the new girl I sparred with...after I finally got her to give me a light tap on the chest, she backs off with her hands over her mouth in shock! "Oh, sorry, sorry, so sorry!"...

 

She must get over this "conditioned" response in order to have effective self-defense. I'm sure she will and she'll make a fine karateka.

 

This (seeming instinct against hitting hard) is a shame, because I stil believe that a striking art is the only thing that would let a small women successfully defend against a larger attacker. Forget grappling and throwing, I guarantee that brute force will win out if you try to wrestle. But even a small woman can in theory strike with enough force to cause damage to a large man's weak points like groin, eyes, nose, temples, etc. A hard kick to the groin is no respecter of strength or size - it hurts every guy the same. Then get the hell out of there.

 

So as you can see, I believe martial arts can be very valuable and effective for women. In fact, I think all women should do self defense, because rapists and muggers are generally relying on the victim to be passive, compliant and non aggressive.

[spinninggumby]

I dunno, I find it weird that Bruce Lee would say that, considering that his foundation was in Wing Chun (before he started experimenting and expanding and creating his own philosophy) and Wing Chun was founded by a woman.

 

 

[Bon]

On 2002-07-15 01:51, Taikudo-ka wrote:

 

Forget grappling and throwing, I guarantee that brute force will win out if you try to wrestle

 

Have you ever grappled, man ?

 

First class I went to, I was using brut strength against smaller opponents. Resistance is futile! Heh. It was really frustrating being more aggressive than your opponent, then being controlled and submitted with relative ease.

 

I think grappling is good for women to take up, the guard is almost exactly how they will end up if someone tries to rape them. It's soo easy to sweep someone from the guard who has no knowledge of grappling.

 

If you don't have the technique right, no amount of power will be much good. I'm not saying an extremely weak person will be able to submit people, explosive power is good, but technique comes into play much more than strength.

 

 

[Bon]

On 2002-07-15 01:51, Taikudo-ka wrote:

 

I think it's a social conditioning thing, like the new girl I sparred with...after I finally got her to give me a light tap on the chest, she backs off with her hands over her mouth in shock! "Oh, sorry, sorry, so sorry!"...

 

lol, exactly what I mean!

 

It's annoying and I probably don't do a girl a favour if I spar with them by not hitting them hard. I've always been cautious since the first time I sparred with a girl I made her cry. I don't have to worry about that much anymore since there's only been a couple of girls come into a class full of guys rolling around on the floor.