Practicing tanbo/hanbo?

[rogue2257]

I just found these videos on Youtube about the nicho tanbo and I'm utterly fascinated. I'd never previously heard of short staffs being utilized in kobudo aside from the jo. Of couse, I'm aware of Escrima and other martial arts using some short staffs but not necessarily any Japanese arts. Does anyone actively practice with the hanbo/tanbo?

It seems a relative rarity in terms of available information. I've not been able to find anything in the way of nicho tanbo kata online, (the way the weapons are shown utilized in the videos below, and how kama, sai, and tonfa are generally used). Anyone heard of these being used like this for traditional forms, or practice with them in class? I think it's something I might like to get into.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn3uaqgb0pc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_H-qYMRHDE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1i13KfILluY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJ87WasqzQk&feature=related

[tallgeese]

I've always had exposure to the hanbo, or as we call it-a club, as part of the core Okinawan set of skill the system I study grew out of. This was such a typical instrument to be used in the circles I "grew up" in that I've always been surprised that it's not taught more.

Here's the thing, stick work from that part of the Pacific Rim tends to look different than what's depicted in the video segments linked above. Okinawan stick is often focused around joint manipulation and application of leverage. Additionally, all my training, prior to cross-training (dabbling might be a better word for the time I spent doing it) in escrima based arts, was based around a single stick model. Again, this is the trend I've seen with Okinawan origin stick work.

I'm not saying that the above vids are misrepresented, I'm just saying that's not my experience in how that particular flavor of stick work is done. There's plenty of systems out there I'm unfamiliar with that may historically do things differently.

It's always possible as well that the above referenced school imported the movements from elsewhere (my sound's not up and running right now, maybe it was covered). Again, I'm okay with that provided that credit is given where it's due.

But, yes, to the original question, hanbo is covered in Okinawan systems. My experience is that it just looks different than above.

[bushido_man96]

I have a book on stick fighting that references various lengths of stick. A mid ranged stick is covered, as well.

One thing that grabs me about weapons work, especially when seeing a new one, is the "need to find a kata so I can practice it." I'm not sure if it comes from the vast majority of Eastern MAs being kata-based systems or what, but I personally think that there are more efficient ways to learn weapons usage than through kata practice.

[tallgeese]

Ditto.

In fact, during my time learning stick, again from an Okinawan based system, we did NO kata for it. This was entirely application drilling that led into spontaneous responses.

[Kuma]

I've done some hanbo training and some jo training. The difference? A foot. They work the same, so if you're doing one you can easily do the other.

[tallgeese]

Again, just speaking from my experience, and one that doesn't include jo training I should add. I don't feel this to be accurate in some regards.

For instance, all the jo work I've seen from karate and kobudo students revolves around striking and some throw work by destabilizing the legs. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Most of the hanbo I've seen is shorter striking used to augment joint manipulation. Throws are done, but many times revolve around the upper extremities or neck and head.

It just seem like a different set of tools that go with the handbo than the jo. Granted, there are so many sects of weapons work out there chances are that I haven't seen all there is to see when it comes to the jo. So take it with a grain of salt.

When push comes to shove during live training, I usually either a)beat the knife out of the attackers hand with the stick, or b) trap his stick via a cover and overhook and beat his legs with mine till he stops fighting.

So much of this is probably moot for me.

[Kuma]

I think it depends on the doctrine of the style. Karate and kobudo tend to be more impact-oriented, so strikes would definitely be used more frequently. I've seen some videos of Aikido using a jo doing many different kinds of throws and locks as well, which is more their doctrine as well.

I think traditional jojutsu tends to be more striking-oriented though as you can see many similar techniques to kenjutsu in it. The only "hanbojutsu" I've seen is through the Bujinkan, which has their own ways of doing things too.

Still, after all it's just a foot. You can do the same stuff with a jo you can do with a hanbo.

[bushido_man96]

I think in the end the way the weapon is used is going to depend more on what the wielder's experience is, as opposed to what "system" the weapon comes from.

A jo could be used in the methods that a bokken is used in Japanese sword arts, if that is all you know. The weight will be different, but it could be made to work if its all you have. Likewise, if a hanbo could probably be wielded like in the manner of an Arnis user, if that's what they come across. So, it will depend on the wielder as much as the system at times.

As for the Aikido reference, at the seminar I attended, we did some paired jo work, and it wasn't exactly like sword work, but it was pretty offensive/defensive, and more about striking with the stick, as opposed to manipulations. This could have been just scratching the surface though.

[rogue2257]

So based on what I'm hearing, what I posted isn't exactly the traditional way hanbo is taught, but it COULD be used that way, similar to escrima. Rather, they are used more for striking and manipulation.

I have a book on stick fighting that references various lengths of stick. A mid ranged stick is covered, as well.

What book were you referencing there? There is quite a number of stick fighting books out there.

[bushido_man96]

Stick Fighting

Masaaki Hatsumi, Quinton Chambers