International Judo Federation leg shoot ban experiment

[gzk]

http://www.intjudo.eu/?Menu=News&Action=Full&type_id=1&id=284&lang_id=2&mid=4

Thoughts?

[joesteph]

From the article:

The IJF concern is that more and more often, wrestling and sambo techniques are seen during judo combats.

 

“That is not good for the future of our sport in the Olympic Games”, says Mr. Barcos.

I do not practice judo, but I do have a question: Does this mean that the sport has been evolving, and the "powers that be" are opposed, not based on judo becoming less effective, but that it must remain frozen in time to present a "purity" or "pedigree" to ensure it pleases the Olympic Committee?

[bushido_man96]

I'm not sure that I would get to shaken up over this, but then again, I am not a Judoka, either, so I don't know how most of them would feel about it.

In the end, its a decision that keeps the uniqueness of Judo competition different from that of other competitions. Much how TKD will likely never allow face punching in the Olympics, to keep it from becoming more like Karate or Kickboxing. I don't have a problem with it, I guess, especially if they want to see more throwing and less single and double leg takedowns.

Where the practitioners lose out, however, is when the schools discard useful techniques to focus on what is used in competition, and therefore the techniques don't get explored anymore. Much like face punching in TKD. Yeah, we might do it in forms and one-steps, but it isn't the same as doing it in sparring. So, if the school is competition-focused, the students aren't likely to see it. Take it for what its worth.

[gzk]

In the end, its a decision that keeps the uniqueness of Judo competition different from that of other competitions.

It will certainly do that, but I don't believe it's necessary.

Leg shoots are a relatively recent introduction to BJJ (via American wrestlers, I believe) and I don't see how anyone would confuse BJJ with freestyle wrestling or Sambo. BJJ took some of the counters from these styles, evolved its own, and created new opportunities to use conventional BJJ techniques from these new situations, eg: the plethora of chokes that are now used from sprawl control, that you won't see in Sambo or freestyle. Why couldn't Judo take that route?

[bushido_man96]

I would guess because Judo doesn't want to be like BJJ or Wrestling. I imagine they want to focus on throwing, and not sprawling to defend a single leg takedown. The powers that be probably feel that if you want to do stuff like that, then you should do it in a BJJ or other Submission Grappling venue.

[gzk]

I would guess because Judo doesn't want to be like BJJ or Wrestling. I imagine they want to focus on throwing, and not sprawling to defend a single leg takedown. The powers that be probably feel that if you want to do stuff like that, then you should do it in a BJJ or other Submission Grappling venue.

What I meant was that perhaps these techniques open avenues for new applications of judo. I'm not suggesting judokas should sprawl and go for an anaconda choke like a BJJ player might; maybe there is a new way to pin or throw for ippon from there, or a new setup for an old throw? If there isn't now, surely they would evolve?

[tallgeese]

Again, not a Judo guy, but I don't see too much of an issue.

Judo, as a sport, has it's unique identity. I would imagine that the guys running the show just want to keep it unique. Yes, you lose access to some great takedowns. But, it's only in competition, nothing says they won't be training them at schools everywhere.

As for keeping the rule set in that state for competition, I don't see the harm. Comps are the sport expression of a given art. I don't see an issue with making sure they continue to look like Judo.

Not everything is freestyle or mma.

[bushido_man96]

I would guess because Judo doesn't want to be like BJJ or Wrestling. I imagine they want to focus on throwing, and not sprawling to defend a single leg takedown. The powers that be probably feel that if you want to do stuff like that, then you should do it in a BJJ or other Submission Grappling venue.

What I meant was that perhaps these techniques open avenues for new applications of judo. I'm not suggesting judokas should sprawl and go for an anaconda choke like a BJJ player might; maybe there is a new way to pin or throw for ippon from there, or a new setup for an old throw? If there isn't now, surely they would evolve?

I think that the deal is, they Judo players to stand up and throw, not shoot and take down. So, they are eliminating the desire to do that by instating these rules.

[Toptomcat]

What's the distinction between a 'throw' and a takedown, though? I think you could make a pretty good case that a great many of judo's ashi-waza and sutemi-waza aren't purely 'throws'.

[bushido_man96]

I think a throw is more distinctive than a takedown. A takedown, in my mind, would more or less tie up a leg (or both), and be more concerned with driving the body through the legs of the opponent. A throw, in my mind, would be more akin to either hoisting the body off the ground, or removing one or more of the legs from under the body while using the hands on the upper body to force it over a fulcrum, like the knee, a blocked foot, etc.

That's just the way I see it, though.