Failing Tests

[RichardZ]

Really? What level and what art? Can you please further elaborate so that I may understand better (I never known anyone to fail a martial art test)

[bushido_man96]

I was doing a mid-term test as a 1st dan in the ATA. I missed a board break. It happens at times.

If there isn't the possibility of a failure, then why is it called a test?

[RichardZ]

I was doing a mid-term test as a 1st dan in the ATA. I missed a board break. It happens at times.

So, you completely failed the rank from a failed board break?

If there isn't the possibility of a failure, then why is it called a test?

Good point. But a martial art test is designed to observe the skill of the student based upon past performance until point of test. If the student could not do it before the test, the instructor should not have given the test. I would think the test is not a real test but a review, set upon by skill which is already known to exist, and not dogmatic knowledge.

[bushido_man96]

I was doing a mid-term test as a 1st dan in the ATA. I missed a board break. It happens at times.

So, you completely failed the rank from a failed board break?

Yep, had a no-change. There is a 90, 80, 70, 60 scale on all sections of the testing, and you have to accumulate so many points to pass. At the board breaking stations, you can miss twice, but after that, its pretty well downhill from there.

If there isn't the possibility of a failure, then why is it called a test?

Good point. But a martial art test is designed to observe the skill of the student based upon past performance until point of test. If the student could not do it before the test, the instructor should not have given the test. I would think the test is not a real test but a review, set upon by skill which is already known to exist, and not dogmatic knowledge.

If there isn't a risk for failure, then you can't really call it a test. As an instructor, I do all that I can to make sure that a student is ready to test. If they get there and freeze up, or just have a bad day, then I have no control over that.

I also think that although the instructor should hold some accountability for his students, I also think that the student needs to hold him/herself accountable, as well. There comes a time when the training wheels have to come off. Would I feel bad if I had a student that didn't pass? Sure. Would I be kicking myself and blaming myself because that student didn't pass. No. Why? Because the student has to take some responsibility and prepare. They also need to realize that if they do fail, then they just have to get back to work, and hit it the next time.

[sensei8]

I cant see how anyone could fail a martial art test.

With everything, including martial arts tests, Yin/Yang is real. Pass/Fail, Win/Lose; we can't have one without the other to balance it all out. If one hasn't ever failed a martial arts test, then I submit that this person hasn't been truly tested as of yet!

I can't count on both of my hands and feet as to just how many times I failed a test. Why did I fail? My Soke/Dai-Soke are extremely tough on tests. Nothing was ever guaranteed to us students and when we did pass, well, it was an accomplishment! Nothing is perfect, but with Soke/Dai-Soke, you'd better be as close to perfect as possible or you'd fail! In their very bad broken english, they both could say the word "Fail" very well!

Edited November 9, 2009 by sensei8

[ninjanurse]

If there isn't a risk for failure, then you can't really call it a test. As an instructor, I do all that I can to make sure that a student is ready to test. If they get there and freeze up, or just have a bad day, then I have no control over that.

I also think that although the instructor should hold some accountability for his students, I also think that the student needs to hold him/herself accountable, as well. There comes a time when the training wheels have to come off. Would I feel bad if I had a student that didn't pass? Sure. Would I be kicking myself and blaming myself because that student didn't pass. No. Why? Because the student has to take some responsibility and prepare. They also need to realize that if they do fail, then they just have to get back to work, and hit it the next time.

Exactly. Sometimes we have to make the tough decision to hold a student from testing and hold them accountable to not only our standards but their own as well. We have a power test for all red belts and, regardless of how good their technique and skills are, they must pass to be promoted. Getting a rank without meeting the standard serves to only denigrate the art.

[bushido_man96]

I agree, Heidi and Bob. Very much the case when it comes to a test.

[todome]

todome wrote:

Which subforum do I use to lament failing my nidan with flying colours?

Todome,...

Sorry sk. Didn't even notice this thread until now.

The test was a bit of an uphill struggle from the get-go. Our dojo didn't get notice of it until around 6 weeks before which left us trying to rattle our acts together in time. A few more weeks might have made a difference, may not, but back then I knew going in I'd have to have a good day to pass. I didn't*. Having totally screwed up Kanku Dai after a rather lacklustre kihon, I knew before the test was finished that I wasn't going to pass and I'm glad I didn't because after all was said and done I didn't think I deserved to.

What I felt the worst about was that Sensei wanted me to test (he tells you to test, you test, no?) and I felt then and still feel now that I had let him down. It does get to the point where you should test for the good of the dojo, not just yourself. He was right, too. It was time for me to test. Pass or Fail, it gives everyone else something to look forward to and hopefully something to strive for.

I might have done better somehow but that's water under the bridge and tomorrow's another day. I'm happy to report my 'tough time' was quite brief. More importantly than being dissappointed, which of course I was, I got a taste of where I needed to go to get there and have turned up the effort getting ready to test again next April. Hell. I even quit smoking.

So I may have failed the belt test and had to endure the embarrassment that went with it, but I like to think I passed the karateka test. It IS supposed to be about character after all.

* my excuses:

1) Tweeked my knee just before the test so placing weight on it was a worry.

2) Being two days into what turned into a two-week bout of what was probably the swine flu, I was totally totally totally running on empty. Did I say totally?

3) I was jonesing for a smoke. Not a showstopper but it sure didn't help.

[Throwdown0850]

Not really. Martial art tests are not like trying to win a ball game. And, we are not talking tests like college finals either. I cant see how anyone could fail a martial art test.

How about failing to perform a technique on a resisting opponent??