Wrist Grabs - DO they work Today?

[Dobbersky]

All

I need to ask the question!

With many styles, included in their syllabus are various techniques for wrist grabs. I can not understand why they are still in the syllabus. I have had many street altercations and I have never had my "wrist" grabbed by my assailant. I may have had my "collar" grabbed or shoulder but never my wrist.

I can understand back in the day when swords were carried by Samurai and chinese swordsmen then the wrist grab would be used to prevent them from drawing their swords but I can not see it as a useful technique to have over two dozen techniques for.

I await your responses and I am happy to retract my statement "Wrist grabs don't work in today's society" if I get some good arguements as to why they DO work

Thanks

[tallgeese]

There is the basic premise that they are a controlled and relitively easy way to teach new people proper joint manipulation movement. That's not a bad argument as long as from there they are integrated into more realistic patterns.

A better argument is from a stand point of the likelihood that a bad guy will grab your wrist, often unintentionally during a confrontation that ends up in body to body contact. This is fairly frequent in cases where things start looking like ugly wrestling on the street.

Another, not bad, argument is that often when you start hitting someone, they focus on the weapon at hand that's the threat and will react instinctively to grab and stop that weapon. Sometimes, they will end up with your wrist.

The last, and probabaly best in my opinion, argument has to do with teaching small joint manipulation vs. armed attacks. Small joint stuff, say to the wrist, is not an ideal response in alot of cases. It's kind of tough to do and often takes two hands on one to pull off. This usually puts it down further on my list of options to choose from. However; put a weapon like a knife or gun or stick in a bad guys hand and you've changed the game slightly. Now, control of that weapon becomes paramount regardless of what you have to give up to gain and maintain it during the opening moments of the fight.

It is in this application that small joint manips, like those learned from basic wrist grabs, really come into their own. And the wrist grab is a great teaching method to get students to understand this and get comfortable with them before putting weapons in their hands.

Of course, any of the above arguments are based on the assumption that these skills are taught and drilled as realistic in each step and setting so they can culminate effectively.

So, yes, they still have a place.

[Dobbersky]

Tallgeese-san

Do you think its for the fact that I was incorrectly taught these Wrist-Grips by previous Instructors. The Wrist grips I was taught and seen are a bit lact lustre and I can not see them working in real life. The Techinques I were taught start with an opponent grabing your wrist then you do a series of techniques whilst they just stand there.

There are many joint manipulation techniques found in the Kata even in the Jissen based Kata that I teach which I find much more realistic in street altercations.

My experience for this instance with the "Instructors" who taught me "Wrist Grips" goes from "Basic Kata" which is "taught" as a form only (No Application at all is given for the kata in a realistic motion) then "Self-Defence" techniques including Wrist Grabs etc and One/Three-Step (This is more appliable as it does take some techniques found in the kata but taken to another level).

So If I was taught "correctly" do you think I would have a better view on Wrist grips or would it still be the same?

[Rateh]

I personally don't think wrists are grabbed much in a fight. I do agree that they can lead into learning other joint manipulations though. Our grab escapes (wrist, collar, headlock, etc) probably average 2 moves each. We practice against resisting opponents. The techniques learned in these grab escapes probably won't be used exactly like they are learned. They do lead into our knife defenses however. A strong emphasis is placed on learning principles from the grab escapes, that can be used in other situations. I think this is a good use of wrist grabs.

[sensei8]

"Wrist grabs don't work in today's society"

Sure they do! Why? Because most of us have a wrist or two, and when the attacker FINALLY decides to grab it/them...I'll have some things to help me become free.

Yes, some of the wrist grab escapes that I've seen have caused me to scratch my head in disbelieve as to its effectiveness. Not all techniques work because our attackers weren't cut out of some cookie dough; they're different across the board, to say the least.

Also, some practitioners of the martial arts are beginners, some are intermediate, and some are advanced in thier martial arts, the lack of experience/knowledge might be another reason as to why wrist grab escapes and the like don't work.

Also, some instructors of the martial arts don't have a clue as to what they're doing and these instructors are providing a false sense of security to their poor students; that's all I have to say about that.

Tuite is a powerful tool...when performed properly!

[sensei8]

I personally don't think wrists are grabbed much in a fight.

I agree! But...one must prepare for the unforseen when it finally does happen.

[The BB of C]

I stand firm on anything working if it's taught correctly. Your wrist might not get grabbed right off the get-go, but it might happen eventually. When it's happened to me is when I tried to counter throw someone and they grabbed my wrists to prevent me from finishing the throw. From there, it turned it into a wrist lock and still managed to throw him. It was more of an Aikido throw than anything else.

[JusticeZero]

The way i've heard it is "You learn all these ways to destroy someone if they grab your wrist.. who would grab your wrist? You have to give the wrist TO them first!"

[sensei8]

The way i've heard it is "You learn all these ways to destroy someone if they grab your wrist.. who would grab your wrist? You have to give the wrist TO them first!"

You do? I disagree. My Tuite is solid, and I guarantee this, I don't have to have anyone give me their wrist(s). If I want the wrist(s) in the process of Tuite...I'm going to get one and/or both. It's what you do with the wrist(s) when you get them that counts!

[tallgeese]

It might not be a question of "giving it to them", it just might happen in the course of conflict.

As to not getting grabbed too often, I disagree. Lots of guys I go to lay hands on will do exactly that sort of thing, or put themselves in a position to utilize tactics learned from practicing manips from there.

As to if they were taught properly or not, Dobbersky, it's hard to tell without seeing how exactly they were taught. That being said, one of the major components to any small joint work is the idea of striking prior to drilling them. This sort of set up will make them much more functional.

Even executed properly, I disagree with BB of C, things can and do fail to work. Best to keep this in mind and be ready to move on if something doesn't work out.