Karate Schools today...

[ironsifu]

What would you say these guys should rank?

In our school these kids would stay at 1st kyu (brown) for a long long long long long time.

intermediate at best. but consider that he is only 7 years old. but this like a 7 year old who wants to be a doctor right now, at 7 years old. i'm sorry mikey, you want to be a doctor, but you can't, your too young. the black belt is same thing, you dont just give it to a kid cause he wants it even he is going through the motions. this is not something we just award to kids because they want it and they hang around long enough.

if your business depends on it, then give a "children's rank", but make sure they understand this is not the same thing the adults get.

i said it before, but this is a different kind of business. our customers are not the boss in the martial arts business, and if you allow them to, you are no longer a martial arts teacher, you are a businessman.

i am not such a poor understanding person that i dont agree that children should be rewarded for hard work. but you dont give awards to anything less than those who really earned them. black belt, is not a award for being average, it is for excellence. if you award the ones with poor skill, then why should the ones who train hard try harder? there has to be a line you draw, and ask ALL students to come to the line and pass it to receive the reward. this is what the good teacher does, he holds the standard high and then teaches everyone to meet the standards. he does not lower the bar just so everyone will be able to jump over it. not everyone is that kind of material... not every student is willing to work that hard, and not every teacheer is able to develop even the weak students towards good skill.

real martial arts are for special people, it aint for the masses, and only the strong ones, or the ones with a combination of strong desire and good teachers, are good candidates to do it.

[bushido_man96]

I disagree that Martial Arts are only for the strong. They are for anyone who is willing to try. I do think that standards need to be considered when awarding rank, but I think it is also important to consider that not everyone has the same capabilities. Each student needs to be evaluated and ranked on their individual abilities.

Now, that is not a cop-out to allow for poor performances and bad technical skill. But, not everyone is going to be able to give you 300 push-ups, or 50 pull-ups, or run a mile in 6 minutes, and stuff like that. I don't think you can cookie-cutter all black belts. Each deserves individual evaluation and attention, so that the attributes and abilites that they have can become focus points for their training, and they can also evaluate and improve on their weaknesses, too.

[sensei8]

What would you say these guys should rank?

In our school these kids would stay at 1st kyu (brown) for a long long long long long time.

Beginners!

This little girl's wearing a white belt...

[ironsifu]

I disagree that Martial Arts are only for the strong. They are for anyone who is willing to try.

i agree with your second sentence, but in the first sentence, we have different idea about what the word "strong" is. my "strong" is not talking about new students who can already do 100 pushups. it is for the ones who are truly courageous, the ones who might be weak and afraid, but they train and train hard anyway. to me, this is a strong student.

the weak student, who is not physically fit, can always become a strong student if he trains hard, but if we do not demand it of him, he will always be weak. this is the reason we have poor black belters out there. no one is doing what they are being paid to do... train and teach students properly.

[ironsifu]

Beginners!

This little girl's wearing a white belt...

she better than a lot of black belters i know!

[Chuck]

What would you say these guys should rank?

In our school these kids would stay at 1st kyu (brown) for a long long long long long time.

Beginners!

This little girl's wearing a white belt...

The little 7 year old girl is wearing a white belt, but I'm guessing she's from a traditional Karate school with only three belts white, brown, and black.

IMO, As for her rank she's at least a 3rd kyu.

[Chuck]

check out this kid good kime

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4DF8kyQKsw

[BenchModel]

I agree that more Karate schools have become McDojos. But I think that if the school has Jr Black Belts awarded to children that would give the kids more motivation to achieve their best. As long as they know the difference between a Jr BB and a proper adult BB.

I also find it interesting that I used to think that BB were only for "Masters" of the art. But now my opinion has changed. Now I think of BB 1st dan as just a "competent" martial artist and that the higher ranks (like 6th/8th dan) are for true "Masters". But I do think that this change in opinion is a little sad.

But this is why it is necessary to educate the public to let them know that they have to not only choose the right martial art for them, but also find the right school to teach them too.

[algernon]

What are your opinions of colleges who routinely give degrees to small children?

[bushido_man96]

check out this kid good kime

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4DF8kyQKsw

This little girl's wearing a white belt...

Yeah, these kids are great, but I think we are looking at the extremes on both ends here. I'd say these kids are close to being MA prodigies; not many kids are going to be able to attain that level. Hell, there are probably some adults that are going to be able to achieve that level of physical ability and skill (comparatively speaking).

We look at these kids and think "wow, they are phenomenal!" Then, think about what they will be like as adults; "wow, more phenomenal!" They can only get better with age, right? So, is that standard for a black belt? Only the phenomenal ones? I would be willing to guess that the most of us that post here wouldn't consider many of our abilities to be "phenomenal." I know I am not. Does that mean that we cannot be black belts, either? I don't think so.

Lots of kids (in America, anyways) will grow up playing (American) football. They can start when they are around 8, I think. And some will play into middle school, and into high school, and some will get into colleges and play. Put only a small percentage will be "phenomenal," and make it into the professional level, and make the big money for their skills. Everyone else will be relegated to playing on a recreational level. Is this how we are to view the Martial Arts, and attaining the rank of black belt, as well?

no one is doing what they are being paid to do... train and teach students properly.

Someone is out there doing it. I agree that not everyone is, but to say that no one is, is a bit extreme.