Is Goju-Ryu bad for your health?

[Taikudo-ka]

I've come across a bit of controversy about Goju on the web. Some people suggest it is unhealthy, mainly due to the practise of Sanchin, which some are accusing of doing more harm than good.

 

Accusations leveled against Goju include:

 

* Sanchin damages your cardiovascular and pulmonary system, long term.

 

* Sanchin could trigger a heart attack

 

* Sanchin makes you fat, with a big gut.

 

* Sanchin could make you pass out.

 

* Goju practitioners do not live as long, on average.

 

All of which concerned me, because previously I was quite interested in the Goju style...

 

I've also heard that these problems can relate to "improperly practised" Sanchin. But how would you know, if the whole school was doing it wrong, until you keel over?

 

Are these just rumors spread by Shorin and Shi-To practitioners to disadvantage the "competition"? Or is there something behind any of them? Any thin waisted, big chested 80 year old Goju practitioners care to comment?

[Eye of the Tiger]

Look into other styles of karate like shotokan, wado ryu, shorion ryu.

 

Those arte the four largest karate styles in Japan inclueding Gojo Ryu. Or if you want to do Gojo Ryu wait around till someone that knows about this stuff comes along, I think theres a gojo guy here, I'l try and find him.

 

_________________

 

Kickboxer and Wado Ryu Karate SAMA Organisation

 

Former black belt ECKA Karate

 

15 years old

 

[ This Message was edited by: Eye of the Tiger on 2002-07-09 08:10 ]

[SaiFightsMS]

Sanchin is only one kata. And one kata does not necessarily make or break a system. There are many in Goju who have trained for a lifetime.

 

 

[Bitseach]

Could you explain what you mean by Sanchin and why these ppl think it is harmful? Are you talking about the kata?

 

Any odd type of breathing could make one pass out, but normally this would be from hyperventilation. Another thing they could be talking about is the "Valsalva effect" - to do with intrathoracic pressure affecting the vagus nerve which controls the cardiac cycle. (this is why in weight training one is encouraged to breath out upon the exertion of the lift)

 

However I would need more detail from you to answer properly about risks to health!

 

Bits'

 

(ambulance attendant, Human Biology teacher, degrees in Biochemistry and Genetics, and YMCA gym instructor!)

 

 

[rabid hamster]

Exactly what is a sanchin? Whatever it is, I'll try to find out if that's true or not..

[Taikudo-ka]

Yes, Sanchin is a kata. Some people have described the "Valsalva effect" as possibly occuring during Sanchin breathing exercises, particularly if done incorrectly.

 

I know the kata involves breathing and isometric tension exercises, but not being a goju practitioner, I couldn't tell you the details, sorry.

[chh]

When performing Sanchin kata, all muscles in the body should be tensed, and breathing must be conciously controlled. The movements are slow and fluid, as if there is extreme resistance to your every movement in every direction. To give you an idea of it, the first few movements of the kata is to inhale/exhale fully twice, step into sanchin dachi while doing an inhale/exhale, perform a reverse punch with a full inhale, then retract the fist while exhaling, timing the end of the exhale exactly with the fist returning to position. Muscle tension is maintained during the entire kata. You inhale through the nose, exhale through the mouth, very controlled, and at the end of the exhale you finish with a last burst of air, almost like a cough, to fully empty the lungs. Sanchin testing involves another person walking around you while you perform the kata, striking/slapping various muscles to ensure they are tense, some pushing to ensure that your stance is solid and well balanced, etc.

 

I'm no biology expert, and just a beginner in Goju-ryu, but hopefully that gives you a better idea of what the kata is like. From my limited understanding of the risks involved, there are a couple things you could do wrong that would theoretically cause some of the fancy stuff Bitseach was talking about. One is mistaking "controlled breathing" for "restricted breathing." You should not feel like you're not getting enough oxygen. Lightheadedness does happen, admittedly, but I think if it's extreme or happens every time you're probably doing something wrong. The other I've read about is taking the muscle tension thing to an extreme, you don't need to bust out of your gi Hulk-style to perform the kata properly. The goal (remember this is an 8th kyu perception) is to maintain awareness of respiration and all the muscles in the body for the duration of the kata, which really is a considerable feat (breathe, punch, breath, step, shoot! my butt went slack again!). I could see certain types of people mistaking it for a way to showcase their bulging muscles.

 

Anyway, hope that helps. Haven't seen anybody drop dead in my dojo during sanchin practice yet

[--]

Of course martial arts training can hurt you. Look at a well-conditioned Thai Boxer. Some of the tougher ones suffer from such horrible bone problems that they can't walk past the age of 40 or 50.

 

Or Tai Chi. Everybody knows it as a peaceful health excercise. How many of you are aware that incorrect Tai Chi practice can KILL you? Anyone who doesn't believe me, try doing Chen Tai Chi's 2nd form incorrectly. The results range from dizziness to coughing up blood.

 

Or worse, do any of the higher Xingyi forms incorrectly. The isometrics are so strong that you can literally break your back and shoulders by doing a punch incorrectly.

 

All martial arts are dangerous to some degree, and Goju is no exception. If you can't do Sanchin right, don't do Sanchin, period. It will mess you up.

 

I, for one, don't take Goju-Ryu, but was taught how to do Sanchin correctly. Coupled with Qigong, it has helped me sharpen my general reflexes and explosive (fast-twitch) muscle power immensly, as well as making me more concious of breath and energy conservation.

 

Driving an Indy racer will make you a better defensive driver. It can also kill you. Same thing with excercises like Sanchin. Simply put, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

 

 

[BlueDragon1981]

Nothing is dangerous if done correctly. A lot of martial artist live a long time.

[ronryu]

I do not belive it is harmefull . I am a shi-to ryu stylist and we do some of the same kata as goju ryu however we do not do the dynamic tension as hard as they do . I found this out after going to a clinic hosted by Higionna Morio Sensei . I also preforming the kata like the goju ryu styles do . If done properly through the diaphram (sp) it should not have any adverse affects. In other words dont pop a vein when doing sanchin .