Spinning Hook Kick...Where's your apex?

[sensei8]

As fantastic as spinning hook kicks are to perform as well as to watch, spinning hook kicks, imho, is the leader of being the most telegraphic kick.

Many practitioners reach the apex of the spinning hook kick to an opponents head differently than others. Some are flat spins, some are high, some are low, some are medium, some are are swingers, some are floaters, some release the knee to soon/late, some release the hips to soon/late, some don't open the hips at all, some have no proper body mechanics, and some go out then go up.

Therefore, how do YOU reach your apex in YOUR spinning hook kick?

It'll be interesting to see just how differently the apex is reached from one spinning hook kick to another.

[JusticeZero]

For clarification, would you consider a half moon kick to be a "spinning hook", since at no point is the heel tucked in to strike, as the leg is to be left limp for the full arc of the kick for best form? As well as the obvious matter of having a significant portion of the weight on the palms of the hands..

Twist, put the hands down between the legs, put hands between arms, look at target, shift weight forward, and axe kick down into the target's head turning the hip over at the top.

[Rateh]

Starting from a fighting stance as I would teach a beginner (IE cut down step by step in slow motion). Not that you're a beginner, it's just easier to explain this way.

Turn/twist your body without lifting your feet (rotating on the balls - so the rest of your foot should come a couple of millimeters off the ground), until you are looking at your opponent and your hands are now between you and the opponent in a fighting position....but your legs are twisted.

Lift your kicking leg so that it is perpendicular to the floor (like a front kick chamber).

Rotate on the ball of your base foot until your hips and shoulders are sideways to the opponent. Base foot should have the heel facing (or within 30 or so degrees of facing - so you would be rotated slightly more) the opponent though. Sideways means that you are now facing to the left or to the right of the direction you were initially facing (if you were facing north - you would be facing east or west).

Turn your leg over into a side kick chamber position.

Lean backwards directly way from your opponent as you extend your kick, hooking the end of it so that the full extension is as you strike the target...in the middle of your "hooking" motion. At full extension it should look like you are throwing a round kick.

Retract the kick back to a round kick chamber.

Place on the floor in front or behind depending....will change the weight exchange etc depending on which.

Fast speed...turn-look-lift-extend-retract (when done at high speed it is less of a front kick lift and more of a side kick - but thats hard to do in slow motion) Also at high speed there are NO pauses in motion so the turn-look-lift is one continuous turning motion.

The kick should start its extension just to the side of the target...complete its extension as it goes through the target...and retract just past the target.

It should not go in an upward or downward motion, but rather straight across its target.

Does that answer your question?

[bushido_man96]

I teach it like a side kick at not quite 45 degrees to the front of the target you are aiming at. You kick out like a side kick, around 6 inches away from the target. From there, the kick is "hooked" through the target, driving through the target with the leg straight. The kick should drive through about 6 inches, and is then retracted in an exaggerated round kick chamber. Foot remains in side kick position.

Now, the spin heel kick is a different story, as the leg is straight throughout the duration of the kick.

[Shizentai]

Man, this is definitely my least favorite technique. I can do it just fine on any floor, but lately we've been training in grass outside and I keep getting my toes stuck on roots and spraining them when I turn... and I'm pretty sure it's one of the sensei's favorite technique. My poor toes. @_@

It's an ok technique but in general I find it's less than reliable for most people in most situations, which is not simply my opinion, but rather the opinion of several sensei I've had over the years.

[ninjanurse]

Rateh gives a good explanation...similar to what I teach. To answer the "telegraphing" question the kick should be chambered the same as a back kick or side kick so the opponent shouldn't know its coming until it hooks.

[sensei8]

For clarification, would you consider a half moon kick to be a "spinning hook", since at no point is the heel tucked in to strike, as the leg is to be left limp for the full arc of the kick for best form?

No I wouldn't because the key to the kick is....the Hook! Is it a spinning kick? Yepper! But it's not a spinning HOOK kick by its definition.

My style, Shindokan, doesn't kick above the waist...ever. Having said that, a spinning HOOK kick, for me, reaches its apex just at the very moment that the HOOK BEGINS! It's UP, OUT, BACK (HOOKING), and then DOWN. These steps are the basics of what Shindokan stylists define as a HOOK kick. The rest of the label for that kick is just...spinning and kick; self described labels I might like to add. Our leg NEVER remains straight in this kick or the like because the leg is ALWAYS slightly arching towards the apex, as the supporting foot is turning while the hips are beginning to open up, and then at that very moment of that apex...the hooking is executed.

[bushido_man96]

These two versions here are pretty close to the way that I do it and teach it:

1.

Here, especially the target areas and follow through.

2.

[sensei8]

Brian,

In these two video's, I didn't see when, if at all, the hips opened up for the power curve...did you? Seemed more like the power was derived from the momentum of the leg/body as well as to the weight of the leg.

Other than that, I saw that the hook/spin return happened way after impact.

Thanks for those videos!

[JusticeZero]

Hooking in the heel is done with only leg muscle, not the strongest leg muscle at that, is centripetal, and shortening the circumference; it is as such at best perpendicular to the force of the spin.

As a result, I am not clear on what you are looking for with the hook portion. Is it just to modify the angle at which the kick strikes at at the accepted cost of actual stopping power of the kick, or are there details I am not correctly picturing from your descriptions?