The kata topic

[white owl]

Kata is and unwritten record of techniques, which was pass from teacher to student.

Kata is very useful in many ways. For instance kata is very good for strengthening legs and techniques when practicing it right.

[Killer Miller]

If you think of it as Kata against imaginary opponents, then it is Bunkai because you visualize that actual application of technique that would realistically apply in a real situation - which is one of the backbones of practicing/performing kata in the first place.

- Killer -.

1. When MA was outlawed, they practiced MA in the form of a classical dance - called Kata. It was their way to still train and not be classified as MA.

2. Kata is a series of movements or techniques used against one or more imanginary opponents - thus, the Bunkai of Kata...

- Killer -

To your first point - I agree 100%

On the second point. I personally believe that kata is NOT bunkai, but a way to help remember and practice so that you can do bunkai. The movements in kata should not be taken as a literal fight but as a dance to help you remember concepts in fighting.

Hope that makes sense?

[Kuma]

I believe it's in some of Funakoshi's first books, but you can also see some kata referred to as "styles", which might be a bit of an idea as to what they were originally seen as. Possibly, rather than being a set pattern you actually "use" against others, it could instead just be a collection of a system's techniques put into one easy rote way of learning.

I think that the idea of using the word style to refer to kata came from the time when it wasn't unusual to learn just one kata from a master, spend your training time on it, and the applications found therein. Abernethy has spoken about the probabilities of this.

There's a great book about this too. "Five Years One Kata" by Bill Burgar. He studied Gojushiho for five years straight and came up with an entire self defense system just from it, and gives you his blueprint on how to work on your own. Pretty interesting stuff.

[Harlan]

It's a polite way to show some very rude things in public.

What is the purpose of Kata? What is the benefit on practicing them?

[Traymond]

What I was taught

Exercise form when done dynamically

Encyclopedia of self defense

An Art form

What I tend to believe

Its something traditional so we do it to incorporate the old with the new, to honor those that created the martial arts.

[tallgeese]

I agree. I don't think it was ever ment to be a literal interpertation of a fight sequence. I go back to my textbook analogy. It's to store up peices of combat for reference. That's in it's original form at least.

Now modern construct forms are more likely to mimic fight combinations, however, many times I find these wanting in their construction.

[Traymond]

I agree. I don't think it was ever ment to be a literal interpertation of a fight sequence. I go back to my textbook analogy. It's to store up peices of combat for reference. That's in it's original form at least.

Now modern construct forms are more likely to mimic fight combinations, however, many times I find these wanting in their construction.

Yeah haha I cannot see someone doing Pinan Shodan as a real fight...I mean seriously those last four shoto Uke...it would never end like that.

[Adam_XKT]

Having gone a few rounds of sparring with my instructor lately, he's talked about the need to go back to our kata and look at what they teach us.

In theory, that sounds great. This attack comes in, and we do x defense. Kata mentally prepares us to win and the thought of defeat isn't there.

But it is in sparring, and that's what I feel is my biggest obstacle right now. Maybe kata is meant to be what we should mentally prepare for in a real situation - the thought of always winning, which I'm sure that's a part of it. Instinct kicks in, and suddenly (for me anyways) all that mental preparation is gone. A 6-foot, 200-pound man throwing kicks and punches and sweeps is a very intimidating force, and it's hard to maintain that mental attitude when sparring.

This was something I thought of yesterday and am working on flushing out this theory.

[Wa-No-Michi]

Having gone a few rounds of sparring with my instructor lately, he's talked about the need to go back to our kata and look at what they teach us.

In theory, that sounds great. This attack comes in, and we do x defense. Kata mentally prepares us to win and the thought of defeat isn't there.

But it is in sparring, and that's what I feel is my biggest obstacle right now. Maybe kata is meant to be what we should mentally prepare for in a real situation - the thought of always winning, which I'm sure that's a part of it. Instinct kicks in, and suddenly (for me anyways) all that mental preparation is gone. A 6-foot, 200-pound man throwing kicks and punches and sweeps is a very intimidating force, and it's hard to maintain that mental attitude when sparring.

This was something I thought of yesterday and am working on flushing out this theory.

Kata is Kata and Kumite is Kumite.

They are not the same, in order to progress towards Kumite you have to "step out of Kata". As it has been excellently put just recently on another forum that I participate in.

This is a problem that many in the west have imo (including me if I am being honest), because we don't perhaps truly understand where kata fits in to our training structure and how it is best utilised balancing it with Kumite . To say it is simply a repository of Karate "data" limits their purpose somewhat imo.

Understanding how to bridge the gap between Kata and Kumite is I guess an "epiphanal" part of your Karate career but equally is not easy to do - and not a quick thing to do either - many hours of hard training culminating in slugging out with your mates in the dojo me thinks.

But... by the sound of it you have a good instructor to guide you through this transition - more thsn many have, so count yourself lucky.

WNM

[bushido_man96]

I believe it's in some of Funakoshi's first books, but you can also see some kata referred to as "styles", which might be a bit of an idea as to what they were originally seen as. Possibly, rather than being a set pattern you actually "use" against others, it could instead just be a collection of a system's techniques put into one easy rote way of learning.

I think that the idea of using the word style to refer to kata came from the time when it wasn't unusual to learn just one kata from a master, spend your training time on it, and the applications found therein. Abernethy has spoken about the probabilities of this.

There's a great book about this too. "Five Years One Kata" by Bill Burgar. He studied Gojushiho for five years straight and came up with an entire self defense system just from it, and gives you his blueprint on how to work on your own. Pretty interesting stuff.

That would be an interesting read, I think. I may have to search that one out.