Karate and Heart Attacks: Connection??

[gensei]

Hello.

I have been training for 6 or 7 years in Wado, and the more I research past masters of karate (and some other martial arts), the more I find have died early - usually around their early 70's or so - from heart attacks. What's more is that they were largely in decent shape -few were overweight or had terrible diets etc.

I'm just curious if anyone else has heard of or researched this.

Thanks,

TLL

A few examples I've found in a half-hour:

Chojun Miyagi

Masaru Shintani

Mabuni Kenwa

John McSweeney

Angel Kabales (escrima)

Taiji Kase (revived after heart attack)

Shigeru Kimura

Ken Eubanks

Marino Tiwanak

Wally Jay (jujitsu; survived heart attack)

[Giorgos]

But also many masters in Okinawa have lived really long,particularly if you consider the hard times in their youth..Typical examples: Matsumura Bushi (92), Ankoh Itosu(83), Gichin Funakoshi(89),Shugoro Nakazato(90 and going)...

[Traymond]

Lets add

Hirokazu Kanazawa (1931) 78 years old, not to old, but he still teaches

Teruyuki Okazaki (1931)

Kanei Uechi 1911-1991

Chojiro Tani 1920-1998

Kiyotada Sannosuke Ueshima (1893 - 1987)

Hironori Otsuka (1892–1982)

[AlwaysInTraining]

The staple diet of the orient is fatty and unhealthy (e.g noodles, fried pork, fat rich sauces (e.g sweet and sour), etc etc). There is also the problem of genetics where those prone to heart attacks are going to pass this genetic trait off to their children. In these cases, where the japanese only have one child, there is very little genetic diversity so a minor problem over one generation will become a serious one several generations later.

However it is proven that exercise and activity increase your health and your lifespan so these masters will have been traing all their lives and as such will have become healthier and so lived longer. Unfortunatly if they over do it and are still predisposed it is likley that strain and stress take over and so they could have a heart attack. What we do have to remeber, however, this is not true in all cases and these things may be just cases of bad luck.

[The BB of C]

The founders of Aikido and Isshin-ryu were pretty old when they died. Early to late eighties I believe.

I'm not sure what to think about this. It's interesting, that's for sure. I'll have to think about it some more and come back with an opinion.

[tallgeese]

And I'm not sure that the numbers still hold, but didn't the average age of a male at time of death used to be somewhere in that range?

[Traymond]

The staple diet of the orient is fatty and unhealthy (e.g noodles, fried pork, fat rich sauces (e.g sweet and sour), etc etc). .

That has nothing to do with it...Americans are living to be 80 and 90 years old and im sure Chicken nuggets and double cheeseburgers aint the healthiest things for them either.

The staple diet of the orient is Rice in general, which you failed to list, you only listed the unhealthy things. Asians in Asian countries eat more fish than anyone else in any other country, that helps with the Fatty Amino Acids, which is good for your respiratory system and your fat intake.

The only Asians that have a sauce such as sweet and sour would be China, Japan has Teriyaki, and Korea has that sauce they put in with the Sam Geup Sal (whuh im korean and I dont even know the name of the sauce.....)

I am not all certain but I know for a fact that alot of Japanese and Korean fried foods are fried in vegetable oil with a tempur or Panko style batter. Which is not as bad for you as the western french fries or the doughnuts.

Noodles are fatty, but they are not unhealthy. They are far from it,. We need starch in our bodied such as carbs that which martial artists work off quite a bit off with their exercises. So your post seems a bit biased to me, because you seem to be saying that the Diet of the Orient is bad, but whats the differance between the Orient's or the western diet?

Im just trying to figure out why you think those foods are unhealthy, especially since you directed it to the Orient, even though martial artists in general are of any ethnicity.

[Tiger1962]

This puzzles me because I once did some research online regarding Japanese food (and most of the names mentioned above are Japanese) and what I read was that Japanese food is one of the THE healthiest ethnic foods because of all the fish and fresh vegetables that is consumed. The main drawback is the high sodium content that is found in some Japanese condiments and dishes. Now if these guys were eating cheeseburgers, quarter pounders or Big Mac's and fries.........different story. Maybe they were Sumo Wrestlers? Now those guys seem to follow an unhealthy diet.....or perhaps all these heart attacks were genetic defects??

Karate is a form of exercise which is supposed to be healthy for you. (My cardio doc gave me the "ok" to do) so unless you're smashing concrete boulders with your head, have a pre-existing condition or working out in extreme temperatures, I don't think it makes you MORE susceptible to heart attacks. (bite my tongue, watch now, I'll get struck down!)

I read this book about the Japanese diet that is very interesting called "Japanese Women Don't Get Old Or Fat" and the author's name is Naomi Moriyama. I highly recommend it to become more informed about the Japanese diet.

Edited January 9, 2009 by Tiger1962

[Wa-No-Michi]

This puzzles me because I once did some research online regarding Japanese food (and most of the names mentioned above are Japanese) what I thought was that Japanese food was one of the THE most healthiest ethnic foods because of all the fish and fresh vegetables that is consumed. The main drawback is high sodium content in some Japanese condiments and dishes. Other than that, I always thought Japanese food was one of the best kinds to eat if you wanted to live long and stay healthy. Now if these guys were eating cheeseburgers, quarter pounders or Big Mac's and fries.........different story.

Perhaps all these heart attacks were genetic defects or else they were Sumo Wrestlers?? Not only that, karate is a form of exercise which is supposed to be healthy for you. Unless you're smashing concrete boulders with your head, or similar, I don't think it makes you MORE susceptible to heart attacks. (bite my tongue, watch, I'll get struck down now!)

There is a book I read about the Japanese diet that is very interesting called "Japanese Women Don't Get Old Or Fat" and the author's name is Naomi Moriyama. I highly recommend it.

Yes, the "traditional" Japanese diet is among the healthiest in the world.

Having said that, a few of the old Japanese sensei that I train with, do have a penchant for the odd cigarette (or 40) a day, and a bottle of whiskey.

That said, they are still alive, and very active... How do they do that?

Must be their diet and training I guess.

[Tiger1962]

Well. There ya go!