Why most people retire at shodan?

[Adonis]

hmmm--- interesting. why do people think black belt is the end?

[joesteph]

hmmm--- interesting. why do people think black belt is the end?

Because other members of society view it that way, and the views of society, its norms, are internalized. The black belt, at least in American society, symbolizes reaching your goal.

Most people are not martial artists, and when the person who reaches that first dan level discovers how much more responsibility goes with it, s/he may need the emotional support of others, but others might not be supportive; they do not understand or appreciate the concept of different dan levels. Spending more time, meaning a continued commitment to scale the dan levels, is generally appreciated only by those truly involved in the martial arts, those who are devoted, and with career and family life included in one's responsibilities in life, it isn't easy to be able to add (or continue) commitments.

Yours is a perfectly logical question to ask, Adonis, as you recognize all that one had to have invested of him- or herself to earn that black belt. It's that there are, IMHO, other, non-martial art factors that weigh in.

[Truestar]

My instructor just promoted one of our black belts to Second Dan during an open house. I was the only other one other than my instructor that knew (which I think displays lots of trust ). He didn't put her through a test, he more like took several weeks to get her back into the grove. She's been training for years and definitely deserved it.

Seeing someone get those two slashes only inspires me to keep going forward. Over the past 6 months I've been transformed into a fat yet decent martial artist at red belt, to a bit more slender (still chubby ) and better martial artist at Shodan. Seeing those two slashes just lets me know that the road doesn't end. I couldn't imagine stopping at this point.

If only other people took more of the philosophical aspect of the art. Many people view black belt as a perfection, when arguably with some it is not. I think when people reach black belt, know there forms well and know the techniques, they think that there is nothing more to do. I think the path to the Dan rankings is not so much physical afterwards, but mental. While there are still patterns to be learned after Shodan a lot of it is doing your best to perfect your current technique, and to look into yourself a little bit deeper.

(My bit of the Dan rankings not being physical shouldn't be read into though, you still have to maintain a certain level of fitness, hopefully you guys know what I mean )

[doug_kissaki]

Seeing someone get those two slashes only inspires me to keep going forward.

It's good to keep aiming at something, but it really shouldn't be the stripes on your belt you are after. Look up to someone for their ability, not their rank.

[Truestar]

The stripes are simply a visual recognition, to want the rank alone is foolish which is why I try my hardest everyday.

[doug_kissaki]

That's definitely the right attitude. We always tell new students that if all they want is a black belt, we'll sell them one for $25 and save them a lot of time and money.

[Prostar]

Generally, I was thrilled as all getout if a student stuck it out to BB. I would welcome each of them to the 2% club, as that is roughly how many people make it that far.

On the other hand, I worried mostly about the group that retired within their first three months in the class. If I kept you for six months, I had you for the long run.

Me? I retired at third dan after 35 years. I know, I could have chased belts a lot more, but family and other reasons slowed me down a bit there.

I suppose the reasons people leave the arts fall into generally basic groups, but a constant has been that new bodies are always needed in the dojo. Even to replace retiring black belts.

[kanku123]

Hello all. Have read with interest the posts here from the outside. I thought it was about time I get more involved.

I remember many years ago a visiting sensei talked about the black belt and how it was actually the beginning of true karate practice. I remember thinking to myself as a yellow belt, "what is he talking about?"

Years and experience gives you a different perspective (hopefully) and there are so many things both physically and mentally that I only began to grasp at shodan.

I feel however that some black belts some time feel a little bored when they look to nidan many years down the line. For like many other schools in our dojo it is not automatic that you go up for promotion, the sensei has to recomend you.

Some also simply had been training for the wrong reason. The rank shouldn't be the goal, bettering self should be.

[SaxonPig]

Do most people retire at Shodan? I think more people drop out at colored belt ranks but I could be wrong.

People quit for many reasons. Family, career, burn-out, advancing age, other responsibilities can all factor into the equation.

Some students become frustrated with lack of progress, either in their own abilities or their failure to achieve advancement in rank or status within the organization. I was at a dojo for many years where the head instructor was pretty stingy in awarding advanced rank. I only fully realized this after leaving and seeing what was happening at other schools. I think some Shodans and Nidans left that dojo because they felt their efforts weren't being fully recognized. Looking back, there were hard working and talented students there who had been training for 15-20 years and were only Nidans in rank. There was only one person at that school who had reached Sandan and he had been training and teaching for 25 years before being promoted to that rank. Seems a little late in coming, to me. I understand that rank should have meaning, but an instructor can go too far in withholding advancement.

Anyway, I can tell you why I dropped out after 19 years (as a Nidan, BTW). I was 37 years old, tired, and in graduate school seeking a career change. Time and energy became the issue. This past May I returned to training after a 16 year hiatus. By August I had blown my knee out.

Sigh... Now the age and general infirmity thing becomes the issue.

[bushido_man96]

This past May I returned to training after a 16 year hiatus. By August I had blown my knee out.

Sigh... Now the age and general infirmity thing becomes the issue.

Man, that's rough. I feel bad for you. My instructor has had several operations on his ankle, and one just recently done on his elbow. I can see how it gets tougher and tougher.

Do most people retire at Shodan? I think more people drop out at colored belt ranks but I could be wrong.

I agree here; many don't even make it that far. In alignment with Prostar's statement:

Generally, I was thrilled as all getout if a student stuck it out to BB. I would welcome each of them to the 2% club, as that is roughly how many people make it that far.

I have heard the same stat myself. 2% make it to shodan, then another 2% of those remaining make it to nidan, then another 2% is knocked off after that, etc.

Its a long, hard road. If it were easy, everyone would do it.