Conditioning your Hand Claws

[joesteph]

Word of warning before you try certain aspects of conditioning training for the fingers and forearms think of the long term effects when you are 60 odd and start getting arthritis in the fingers and so on.

Good point, Fujau. The problem I had from overdoing certain exercises for the grip when weight-training was that I developed "tennis elbow." It's not the most precise term in the world, but anyone who has that pain in the forearm doesn't care what it's called. The fingers are not appendages with muscles. Examining them, you will find bone, connective tissue (ligaments), paddings of flesh, and many nerve endings, but the muscle connection and strength comes from elsewhere. That's how I got tennis elbow; the gripping (and I really overdid it, choosing that brilliant approach of "working through the pain") went up through the hand muscles straight to the outer forearm. Then I had to abandon direct grip exercises in favor of the indirect, such as the gripping of dumbbells while performing curls. (Did you know there's such a thing as "Golfer's elbow"? The pain is on the inner side of the forearm, and a friend of mine developed it from repeatedly doing the heaviest preacher curls he could manage.)

Desensitizing the fingers while maintaining a strong grip seems to be the best-balanced MA approach. My question is if anyone here uses or has used a "kime bag" or an "iron palm bag," both of which are sold by AWMA. Are they genuinely helpful so that the fingers can be conditioned for strikes, or are they more of a novelty item? (Incidentally, the photo of a martial artist striking a kime bag in the AWMA catalog has him using what I would call Single Whip, and some others have referred to as a Chicken Beak [or some description like that].)

[sil lum fighter]

Here are some good exercises to do to strengthen your fingers and hands for any type of hand strike such as eagle claw, tiger claw, dragon claw, etc....

The first one is doing finger tip push ups.

The second one is doing push ups on your wrists. This will stregnthen your wrists which is important for snake stylist and doing spear hand strikes and such.

Third exercise is striking a sand bag with a spear hand, when striking the bag vibrate your hand right as the hand makes contact with the bag.

Fourth exercise is to do palm strikes on the bag, vibrating the palm when making contact.

Remember it is always good to use a good dit da jow afterwards to help with any swelling or pain.

[joesteph]

Third exercise is striking a sand bag with a spear hand, when striking the bag vibrate your hand right as the hand makes contact with the bag.

Fourth exercise is to do palm strikes on the bag, vibrating the palm when making contact.

Why the vibrations for finger and palm strikes, Sil Lum Fighter? And do you continue the pressure while doing this?

[sil lum fighter]

Third exercise is striking a sand bag with a spear hand, when striking the bag vibrate your hand right as the hand makes contact with the bag.

Fourth exercise is to do palm strikes on the bag, vibrating the palm when making contact.

Why the vibrations for finger and palm strikes, Sil Lum Fighter? And do you continue the pressure while doing this?

The purpose of the vibrating is because if you don't, when you strike the bag the impact or shock of the strike will bounce back and up your arm and cause damage to you. Over time it can cuase damage/effect your vision. I know this sounds crazy, I thought that too but it has been documented. Also the vibrating serves another purpose as well, it cultivates chi flow and can cause internal damage to the person you strike (if done to the proper vital area and/or pressure points).

[fujau]

Third exercise is striking a sand bag with a spear hand, when striking the bag vibrate your hand right as the hand makes contact with the bag.

Fourth exercise is to do palm strikes on the bag, vibrating the palm when making contact.

Why the vibrations for finger and palm strikes, Sil Lum Fighter? And do you continue the pressure while doing this?

The purpose of the vibrating is because if you don't, when you strike the bag the impact or shock of the strike will bounce back and up your arm and cause damage to you. Over time it can cuase damage/effect your vision. I know this sounds crazy, I thought that too but it has been documented. Also the vibrating serves another purpose as well, it cultivates chi flow and can cause internal damage to the person you strike (if done to the proper vital area and/or pressure points).

and also when the strike is vibrated the pain is more intense try squeezing something tender you will find your body can adjust to the pain but if your vibrate the squeeze the body can not really adjust to the pain

which is really good in chinna

[RichardZ]

Thats a good question. I think the more appropriate question is whether or not that kind of conditioning is worth it. What will the long-term effects of conditioning your fingers in such a way be? I think the better path to take would be to do grip exercises and forearm exercises instead. Easier to do, with faster results, I think.

I have to agree. back in earlier eras, certain conditioning had to be sought. However, not everyone can be conditioned or have positive results via conditioning as another. In other words, conditioning may not help certain people.

There are long term detremental effects from conditioning, that in present society, is not warranted in a social norm.

[bushido_man96]

Thats a good question. I think the more appropriate question is whether or not that kind of conditioning is worth it. What will the long-term effects of conditioning your fingers in such a way be? I think the better path to take would be to do grip exercises and forearm exercises instead. Easier to do, with faster results, I think.

I have to agree. back in earlier eras, certain conditioning had to be sought. However, not everyone can be conditioned or have positive results via conditioning as another. In other words, conditioning may not help certain people.

There are long term detremental effects from conditioning, that in present society, is not warranted in a social norm.

As an example, there is a 5th dan at our headquarters school that doesn't do hand technique board breaking, because he is a doctor by profession. He can't afford to mess up his hands on a board break, so, he is allowed to other techniques.

[RichardZ]

That is part of the point I am making. With so many things to do to make a livihood, putting oneself through heavy conditioning seems outdated.

Also to mention, conditoning was important for top martial arts back eras ago as many were body gurads and military.

Also, think about the reprecusions. If one seriously harms someone with it, and it gets to court, I dont think the court or a jury will find in favor of someone who seemed to premediate a training method to do great bodily harm with the hands. To some people, this may seem extreme.

[bushido_man96]

That's why a more gradual conditioning would be favorable. Not the kind that tends to deform the look of the fist.

[RichardZ]

good point. I understand. Gradual or not, there still could be long term effects. Anyone here been doing this for 40+years?

Now, I am not against condtioning with moderation, but, is it really needed?

I have seem many street bouts and I doubt those who were victorious did any time if hand conditioning in such fashion.