Heian Godan jump...

[Wa-No-Michi]

Would you be upset if I was?

[bushido_man96]

Good thing about kata there is no ''only one'' bunkai.

Yes I agree, but there comes a point where you have to stop your imagination overtaking common sense.

Unfortunately, there seem to be quite a few "high profile" authors of karate bunkai books these days that seem to "pray" on junior karate-ka's lust for the rapid and total understanding of karate-do with theories and applications that are so creative and imaginary some deserve an Oscar.

Don't get me wrong, they serve their purpose to an extent, but they are no substitute for a knowledgeable instructor in my eyes.

In referring to these books, would you be alluding to the likes of Iain Abernethy?

I wouldn't be uset...after all, I am not him. However, I do think that he has put together quite a nice volume of work.

[Wa-No-Michi]

That's great then.

[Wa-No-Michi]

Book authors to one side, have you got any thoughts of your own, in terms of explanation as to what this move could be?

[bushido_man96]

Perhaps a cross-collar choke to a downed opponent. The jump could be a jumping attack onto the opponent prior to the choke.

However, this is just guess work on my part. Unfortunately, my school doesn't do any forms applications, so any work I do is based off of other ideas, and then toying with it. I have a TKD book with an interpretation of it, too.

[DWx]

I do the same forms as bushido_man96. For that technique, we say it is checking block (although you could modify it slightly to be used for something else). Primarily checking a kick or attack coming upward towards the defender's lower abdomen/groin.. The idea for us is to intercept a front kick like attack, therefore the positioning of the arms are natural and not stretched or too bent (if that makes sense) and have to be so that you don't have to lean forward or backwards to reach the attacking tool. Otherwise you'd risk getting punched in the face and upper torso. This also allows for maximum body mass above the technique making it stronger (and easier to balance). You control the height of the technique with your stance, however in the x-stance that we would use in the Toi-Gye form, if you position you're feet properly there is a limit to how low you can go before the stance locks and stops you from moving. So in this context (Toi-Gye) I would say its only real application is the block, possibly followed by a grab on the leg but much better follwed by what's used earlier in the form, the twin punch.

As for the jumping part of it, in Toi-Gye, you are not really gaining that much distance so you can assume that you are jumping upwards out of the way of a sweeping kick or similar motion before landing on the subsequent kick.

Don't know how relevant this is to Heian Godan but it does bear some resemblance and there are some parallels between the Chang Hon forms and kata.

Edited November 4, 2008 by DWx

[swadoryu2000]

Cool. Interesting bunkai, DWx!

[Fish]

Wa-No-Michi, you comment that the nagashizuki is unlikely to lead into a throw - depends how you see it. Suppose it is not a punch, but a thrusting push to the head or the shoulder of the opponent. You thus unbalance them, and complete the sequence by twisting while bending the knees -- lowering your own centre of gravity, thus depositing them on the floor and ending as I've described.

You may think I'm letting my imagination run away with me, but on the other hand there is a picture of Ohtsuka in what appears to be that nagashizuki stance, with his open hand pushing against the opponent's chin.

[Wa-No-Michi]

Wa-No-Michi, you comment that the nagashizuki is unlikely to lead into a throw - depends how you see it. Suppose it is not a punch, but a thrusting push to the head or the shoulder of the opponent. You thus unbalance them, and complete the sequence by twisting while bending the knees -- lowering your own centre of gravity, thus depositing them on the floor and ending as I've described.

You may think I'm letting my imagination run away with me, but on the other hand there is a picture of Ohtsuka in what appears to be that nagashizuki stance, with his open hand pushing against the opponent's chin.

These guys do something similar. Have a look at the bunkai vids here. They have one for Pinan Godan that features a throw instead of a jump.

https://www.wadokaratemagic.co.uk/gallery.html

For me, it changes the shape and therefore the reason for doing the kata in the first place, but I always enjoy watching / listening to other peoples interpretations.

I try to keep an open mind in this respect.

[swadoryu2000]

Well, I think everyone has their own reasons for performing kata, whether it be physical, or mental, or whatever. It is a good video Wa-No-Michi suggested...very insightful. It's good to have an open mind--not just for martial arts, but for other things too.