Christian artist

[The BB of C]

One of the ten commandments is "Thou shall not kill." So I follow that, and even further, don't even practice techniques that could cause permanent damage to an opponent.

Wow, so you don't practice anything but tying your belt? After all, even a good block could break an arm, and that would cause permanent damage.

However, maybe I am over-reacting, just what techniques don't you practice?

My offensive and/or counter-defensive techniques is a variety of basic strikes. The more advanced techniques I practice are designed to work with the opponent's (and mine) natural mechanics and weaknesses. This is a lot like most lethal techniques or techniques in general that do damage. However, they're toned down, adjusted, or the aim is changed to cause an extreme amount of pain. In most cases though, it does damage that can be treated. If performed correctly, the most damaging attacks I would use would break a hand, finger, arm (in certain ways) and/or dislocate a joint.

My blocking is a wide variety of ways that either reverse or redirect the opponent's energy. If done correctly, they're knocked off their center of gravity.

That's the kind of stuff I do practice. When an instructor shows me a technique that could do permanent damage, I go home and start adjusting it to bring similar effects without lasting damage.

I would say you kind of over reacted. Only practice tying my belt? No. I don't understand why it's so hard for some martial artists to grasp, but it is possible for an average-Joe to defend himself without crippling someone. There are several battle-tested styles before my own and are still in existance and widely practiced that think the same way I do.

Actually 'Thou shall not kill' is a mistranslation, although it is understandable how it came about. That particular term started with the king James bible as the first major edition to appear in (granted, dated) English. However the actual term translated from original Hebrew is 'You shall not murder'. Granted both actions involve killing, however the difference is intent and purpose/justification. For instance, lets say I don't like someone so I shoot him. Is such an action justified? On the other hand, what if someone is on a shooting rampage and I can stop them with a gun before they kill someone else. Both cases involve the action of killing, however the reasons for doing so make the difference if it was justified or not. You could say the same thing for driving. What if one day I go 100 MPH through the neighborhood to buy drugs, while the next I drive my grandmother to the hospital? I drove in both cases, however in one my driving was 'bad' and the other my driving was 'good'. What's the difference between manslaughter and murder? An act of self defense and picking fights? So it is the same for that particular commandment. That isn't to say that it is bad to want to avoid hurting someone- I'd say that is a very good thing. And lets face it- are most of the killings done in the world not done for good reasons?

Very interesting. However, I think I'll stick with what I have now and get good at it. I know with my whole existance as a martial artist that it's possible to turn a gun on someone who put it on your temple and not kill them, to defend one's self with no intention of harming the assailient even when the assailient wants to harm you, and various similar scinarios. And just to let you know, nearly all of the self-defense killings I've heard about, the defender went overboard and did more than he needed to.

Also, I'm not talking about war or law enforcement. I'm talking about just an average, every-day citizen.

[KarateEd]

I understand where The BB of C is coming from in that one's first goal in a self defense situation shouldn't be to end the life of the attacker, but preserve the lives of those being attacked. In many situations this won’t require killing the attacker. However, if the attacker displays no regard for human life, then, in my opinion, the best mindset as a defender should be to disregard the life of the attacker. Does this mean that if you thwart the attack and render the attacker unable to defend himself that you continue to beat on him until he is dead? No, but entering a self-defense situation prepared for a life-and-death struggle primes you mentally to do what it takes to survive and keeps the attacker from gaining the advantage simply because he is ready to kill you and you are not prepared to fight for your life.

As a Christian I am of similar mindset as NightOwl. I don’t think that killing in self-defense, if necessary, is condemned via the “thou shalt not kill” commandment, but only murder (or, in other words, killing motivated by sinful purposes). As a matter of fact, Ecclesiastes 3:1-8 (made famous by the Byrds rendition of Pete Seeger’s song “Turn! Turn! Turn!”) states that there is a time for war. War usually results in the killing of people, however, at times, according to scripture, it is justified. I believe this can be applied in a more personal manner such as in self-defense situations.

Ed

[mmljpp]

One of the ten commandments is "Thou shall not kill." So I follow that, and even further, don't even practice techniques that could cause permanent damage to an opponent.

Wow, so you don't practice anything but tying your belt? After all, even a good block could break an arm, and that would cause permanent damage.

However, maybe I am over-reacting, just what techniques don't you practice?

no there are many techniques if practiced correctly cannot harm somone just injury and just in a conflict i am not going to kill anyone lol

Even if it was the only way to stop your opponent? I think none of us wants to kill another person but you can't afford to pull your techniques to avoid seriously injuring someone because you will end up losing wither that be your valuables or your own life. Similarly if I was presented with an opportunity to attack someone with a technique that could be potentially fatal I wouldn't hesistate, its my life or there's and unfortunately your attacker is unlikely to have those kind of morals.

yes ill agree with you if it is the only way i would

[bushido_man96]

I am in agreement with Karate Ed on this one. If the your first thought in a self-defense situation is "I hope I can not hurt this guy too bad" then I definitely think you are going to be in the wrong state of mind.

[The BB of C]

Does anyone believe there is a medium? Is it possible to have the "correct mindset" and still preserve the life of an assailent? I believe there is.

[KarateEd]

I don't think defending oneself and preserving the life of the attacker are mutually exclusive, I just think that focusing on the attacker's well being in a self-defense situation can only serve, as Takuan Soho says in his book The Unfettered Mind, to "capture your mind" thus handicapping your ability to function decisively and efficiently, giving a determined foe the advantage. Genetics may give an attacker the advantage in size and strength, but I am determined not to let him have the mental advantage, which is one reason I train in MA.

Ed

[bushido_man96]

I agree with Ed here. I can see your concerns, BB of C, however, I just think that if you worry more about not hurting the person who is attacking you, then you will do yourself a disservice.

If you are fighing someone that is trying to kill you, and you are more concerned about his well being than he is of yours, then you are already behind the 8-ball. Granted, not everyone that is trying to hurt you is trying to kill you, but that doesn't mean that it won't happen by accident.

[The BB of C]

I think I know how to explain what I think now:

I train and learn tecniques (original or adjusted) that would temporarily immobilize an assailent, but train instinct so that in the actual scinario, I'm looking out for myself, but whatever I do to him, won't hurt him too bad. For example, knock-out, dislocating a joint or limb, putting the assailent in a state where they're in such pain that they don't want to continue, or perhaps even a Kyoshujutsu?

[bushido_man96]

To be honest with you, BB of C, I think that you worry too much about something that is very unlikely to happen. The human body is quite resiliant, and the likeyhood of you killing someone in an altercation, short of striking their throat or the like, isn't as high as you might think.

[The BB of C]

Thanks for catching me on that. I swear my parents are rubbing off on me.

I know what the body can handle. But still, I can't help it sometimes. We've all seen a lot of scary techniques and most of the people I know who do martial arts do it either just because they want to get into shape or with the mentality "I do it so if anyone screws with me on the street I'll be able to break their neck in half."

In other words, they do it just because they think the only way out, reguardless of everything else, is dismembering an assailent. So I'm just a tad paranoid sometimes. I'm sorry.