Demanding Respect from other MAs a defeatist attitude?

[YoungMan]

There are plenty of people in martial arts that I would be polite to, yet have no respect for, many in Tae Kwon Do, many not.

Respect is not automatic. Respect must be earned, otherwise it is simply fear or, as it was eloquently put, blind respect given to a generic Instructor or style creator.

And just because someone creates a style does not mean they are entitled to respect. Respect is given after it is shown they, their style, and their students have consistantly shown themselves worthy of respect. And not just in the ring, on the street, and in the classroom. Few styles and Instructors merit this.

[wingedMonkey]

There are plenty of people in martial arts that I would be polite to, yet have no respect for, many in Tae Kwon Do, many not.

Respect is not automatic. Respect must be earned, otherwise it is simply fear or, as it was eloquently put, blind respect given to a generic Instructor or style creator.

And just because someone creates a style does not mean they are entitled to respect. Respect is given after it is shown they, their style, and their students have consistantly shown themselves worthy of respect. And not just in the ring, on the street, and in the classroom. Few styles and Instructors merit this.

I know what you mean, there are many high rank color belts i know that kinda "demand" respect, and you can kinda tell. I don't like people that do that, you are supposed to respect those that are younger/lower rank than yourself too.

[bushido_man96]

Exactly my point. Respect is a quality of human being that martial arts can foster and help grow in those that want it to. But the two aren't mutually exclusive.

I agree with you, and this is part of the reason that MMA tends to get ripped up by more "traditional" stylists. Sure, these guys talk and yack, and look a bit rougher than the average joe, but just because they don't bow back and forth, etc., doesn't mean that respect is non-existent. In fact, they probably have more respect for each other, and it is more what they feel inside themselves, about how good of fighters each are.

I'm talking about respect that's being demanded as a crutch (thanks BM ) as a substitute for reasoning. For example, if someone were to join KF, and make a statement like "I do style ABC and it's the best!". I respond with "I don't think style ABC is that great because of X, Y, and/or Z." And then the original poster replies with "Well as a martial artist you should respect my style and what we do, even if it's different." This is the essence of my issue.

In this situation, the MMA guys kind of avoid this situation, because if something doesn't work for them, they have the opportunities to put their ideas to the test in the ring. If it doesn't work, then there is no scenario like the one that you have mentioned before.

[bushido_man96]

There are plenty of people in martial arts that I would be polite to, yet have no respect for, many in Tae Kwon Do, many not.

Respect is not automatic. Respect must be earned, otherwise it is simply fear or, as it was eloquently put, blind respect given to a generic Instructor or style creator.

And just because someone creates a style does not mean they are entitled to respect. Respect is given after it is shown they, their style, and their students have consistantly shown themselves worthy of respect. And not just in the ring, on the street, and in the classroom. Few styles and Instructors merit this.

I know what you mean, there are many high rank color belts i know that kinda "demand" respect, and you can kinda tell. I don't like people that do that, you are supposed to respect those that are younger/lower rank than yourself too.

I agree. Respect is recipricol.

[username8517]

I agree with you, and this is part of the reason that MMA tends to get ripped up by more "traditional" stylists. Sure, these guys talk and yack, and look a bit rougher than the average joe, but just because they don't bow back and forth, etc., doesn't mean that respect is non-existent. In fact, they probably have more respect for each other, and it is more what they feel inside themselves, about how good of fighters each are.

whole-heartedly agree.

[The BB of C]

I ask that members of other martial arts respect other martial artists in a sense that no style is superior to another. After that, the individual must earn respect as a martial artist. I hate it to Hell when someone says "I'm a better martial artist than you because I'm [this rank/a member of this style]." That's the most arrogant thing I can hear a martial artist say.

As far as style, I respect all styles. As far as the individual, I respect good martial artists. I believe a good martial artist is humble, respects himself, others (reguardless of style and rank), continuously works hard to improve themselves in their field, is open minded about techniques, and is effective at his techniques.

[ninjanurse]

HERE,HERE!!!!

[username8517]

I believe a good martial artist is humble, respects himself, others (reguardless of style and rank), continuously works hard to improve themselves in their field, is open minded about techniques, and is effective at his techniques.

This is exactly what I'm getting at. Martial arts, at their core, are about being able to defend yourself. Having respect for oneself or others does not dictate how skilled or good one is at martial artist or not.

Now if you were to say, "I believe a good human being is. . .", that would something I completely agree with.

[bushido_man96]

I believe a good martial artist is humble, respects himself, others (reguardless of style and rank), continuously works hard to improve themselves in their field, is open minded about techniques, and is effective at his techniques.

This is exactly what I'm getting at. Martial arts, at their core, are about being able to defend yourself. Having respect for oneself or others does not dictate how skilled or good one is at martial artist or not.

Now if you were to say, "I believe a good human being is. . .", that would something I completely agree with.

I agree as well.

I had been thinking about these quotes below as well:

I agree Rick. Being polite and respectful are two entirely different things.

If you return a bow, you might be doing it because you are just being polite, and you don't have to respect the person.

The same goes for other styles. You can e polite to a person of another style without respecting them.....

I think it is also possible to respect someone that you do not like. There are people that I do not care for at all, but I do respect them for a level of knowledge that they have, or for being a certain skill level, and for the work that they have done to get to that level, etc. You can also be polite to someone without liking them or respecting them.

[YoungMan]

As my Instructor has told me several times, respect the rank if not the person holding it. There are several people in our Organization that I respect as a holder of X Dan, and bow out politeness. I don't necessarily respect them as people or martial artists, but I will respect them as one martial artist to another.

I've generally found that the more they demand respect, the less they deserve it. That goes for any martial arts instructor, TKD or otherwise.