RBSD

[cross]

I think that RBSD training, especially as Cross has presented it, is great training. Perhaps my experiences are rare, but of the 4 schools I've trained in, all of them did this and none were called RBSD schools. One was a Kung Fu School, two were shotokan schools, and the one I'm at now is a BJJ school.

There's a huge problem with this training, however. It's intense. This is what makes it both effective and not for everyone. It's fair to say that not everyone who enters a martial arts school is interested in this type of training. Many want to THINK they can fight and defend themselves without ever REALLY doing it.

Because of this, the type of training on cross' videos is usually only done by a small percentage of those who train. That said, especially here in the states, that type of training, while effective, is not very marketable and gains only a few students. I actually get together with a few guys from other schools to do it.

For those who ask what good BJJ is, look at the knife drills. At one point the shirtless guy uses a crucifix neck crank. When they are mounted with a knife, knowing a modified elbow escape would get him out of they guys legs (with positive control of the knife). Too many people watch MMA or tournaments and think that it's what BJJ is about. The fact is that BJJ was developed for the streets of Rio (which are still extremely dangerous). Dealing with knives was an everyday thing. I actually get annoyed when I see a BJJ school focus on nothing but sport applications.

To answer an earlier question, for an attacker attempting to stab you (standing) an armbar wouldn't be so great. But a kimura or keylock are wonderful.

I agree with what your saying ps1. There is definitely value in all kinds of training. At one stage i thought all training had to be hardcore full out or it was pointless. But more and more i enjoy skill training and various types of fitness and conditioning training that has nothing to do with self defense or martial arts.

[Martial_Artist]

Forgive mylack of insight, but shouldn't a martial art already be "reality-based"? I mean, who trains to fight ghouls and ghosts? If your martial art doesn't already teach you to fight in the "real world" (whatever that means...we're not on tv) then you aren't learning a martial art.

The term martial art should already signify "reality based", unless of course, you are learning to fight aliens.

Where did the idea of the separation of martial arts training and "reality based" training begin? The two should be synonymous or at least inclusive.

I prefer not to use the term "reality-based". I don't like the connotation. It's as if anything else is pure fantasy or training for something not real. I believe that if you are learning what I believe is a real martial art then the training for the real world is already there.

I think what has happened is that a vast majority of schools have lost the "martial" part of their art and have become sport schools teaching something not applicable in combat. As a result of a great number of these kinds of schools existing there has arisen some sort of grassroots need for something considered "reality-based", when in essence, your martial art should already be "reality-based" or you are seriously being short-changed in your preparations to defend yourself.

As was stated in a previous post, fighting is not for everyone. And it shouldn't be. Not everyone is mentally cut out for it. There are those gifted few who walk with the natural mind of a fighter and the training only makes them more deadly. Then there are the greater masses who train their minds and bodies to make them deadlier. And then there are the dangerous idiots who delude their egos with a little bit of training and walk the proud step of a fighter, but shrivel in the heat of the conflict.

If you aren't training to win a fight, then you might as well as study Tae Bo or Ballet. At least that's my belief. Don't train in a sport and not learn to fight and then call yourself a martial artist, because you have consciously denied the martial part of being that artist.

.02cents. MA.

[bushido_man96]

I think that some sport-fighting types of training have a better set up going for training for self-defense than some more "traditional" schools would have you believe.

Take Judo and Wrestling, for example. They both go at full resistance, full speed. You learn what you can and cannot do when someone is trying to do the same things to you. Boxing and Kickboxing have advantages because you learn what it is like to be hit, and how to hit back. These sports all have the advantage of training at full speed, with resistance from an opponent. No one is pulling the other fist to the hip, or striking perfect stances, or doing forms. All of the application is right there.

[cross]

I think that some sport-fighting types of training have a better set up going for training for self-defense than some more "traditional" schools would have you believe.

Take Judo and Wrestling, for example. They both go at full resistance, full speed. You learn what you can and cannot do when someone is trying to do the same things to you. Boxing and Kickboxing have advantages because you learn what it is like to be hit, and how to hit back. These sports all have the advantage of training at full speed, with resistance from an opponent. No one is pulling the other fist to the hip, or striking perfect stances, or doing forms. All of the application is right there.

Very True, throw in some realistic knife/stick/gun defense, pre fight psychology and situational awareness drills and you have what you can expect at most of the good rbsd schools.

[baronbvp]

Great discussion. I would add some darkness periodically, as well as training in confined spaces like a bedroom or car. The more you train in reality, the better you'll fight in reality.

[bushido_man96]

Very good point, Baron. No doubt that restricting your environment is a good idea at times. Most of the places where I work would be limited to not much more than 5 square feet of space at times. Very different than running around in a 20 square foot ring.

[dete]

to me we have

TMA (Traditional Martial Arts)

&

Combat Sports

I think RBMA is a link between the 2 and has quickly become a stand alone categorey.

I recommend a person learn how to study and benefit from all three.

[baronbvp]

Most of the places where I work would be limited to not much more than 5 square feet of space at times.

Five square feet? Where do you work, Bushido, in a guard booth? Aircraft cockpit? That is not much room, my friend. Hard to do TKD.

[bushido_man96]

Most of the places where I work would be limited to not much more than 5 square feet of space at times.

Five square feet? Where do you work, Bushido, in a guard booth? Aircraft cockpit? That is not much room, my friend. Hard to do TKD.

I agree. I work in the County Jail here. When the crap hits the fan, it is usually in a pretty restricted space. Maybe 5 foot square is a bit conservative of an estimate on my part, but I don't count the space above me. Our hallways may be 5 foot wide. Most cells, with the bed laying there and the sink/toliet, etc, end up cutting out a lot of space to move and dance in. Not much room for kicking, for sure, except for good low kicks. From there, it is all pretty much hands on.

[tengu-raven]

the rbsd styles that i've seen did'nt impress me that much in the way of teaching revolutionary material. most of what i saw resembled basics that are taught in any number of martial art styles.

the selling point of rsbd appears to be cutting out a lot of material that is not effective and/or reflects tradition. which i suppose is subjective. the end result is supposed to be faster learning. many other aspects from martial arts are lost when thinking strictly in terms of fighting. having functional ability is the most important yet more traditional styles offer so much in addition.