Is this ok?

[bushido_man96]

Question: Why does the instructor feel you need to have a black belt before helping him out in class? I see no problems with a green belt helping.

I think she means that she will be supervising the class on her own at times. That is what I got from it, anyways. Otherwise, I think you would be right; it wouldn't be as necessary.

Do you have a black belt in Karate, Marie?

[ps1]

Don't worry about it. You said yourself that you don't feel like you'll have any material learning the material necessary for the rank. With your previous studies, you've no doubt trained many of the habits that the beginner is supposed to learn before they attain black belt.

When I began studying Shotokan, I already had 14 years of training in other arts. I trained for about 8 months in Shotokan before I earned black. It was mostly a matter of learning the kata, bunkai, and ippon kumite. It took about two years to earn second degree however. And three more for third. There's alot to learn about the art and the forms in those ranks.

I guess what I'm saying is, "Don't sweat it!" I'm sure you deserve the rank. The way you've presented it sounds totally legit.

[Kieran-Lilith]

To those that are saying green belt should be enough...it doesn't sound like she's actually trained in this style before. She'd be a white belt. I think it makes sense to go ahead and learn what you need to learn to be ranked. Yeah, green belts can teach just fine, I'm sure we all agree to that. But white belts have more difficulty.

[AngelaG]

I'm sorry but to me (and please don't take this personally it is just an outside view), it seems like you are trying to justify the awarding of this grade. It appears that you are perhaps not entirely comfortable with the idea of gaining a grade which has not been fully earned. Maybe you are partially worried about letting down, or insulting, your instructor by refusing this grade?

My own opinion (and bearing in mind that advice on the Internet is usually worth what you pay for it ) is that I would not want a grade purely because it fitted in with the instructor's plans at the time. If he was grading you because he had seen you perform and thought you looked seriously under-graded that is one thing; but it seems to me that his motives are not entirely altruistic. Perhaps he needs you to have a black belt so that he can insure you?

I personally don't think I could accept such a garde. It seems that you have worked hard on many other martial arts achievements. Beware that you don't let one dodgy grade sully your reputations.

[ps1]

I'm sorry but to me (and please don't take this personally it is just an outside view), it seems like you are trying to justify the awarding of this grade. It appears that you are perhaps not entirely comfortable with the idea of gaining a grade which has not been fully earned. Maybe you are partially worried about letting down, or insulting, your instructor by refusing this grade?

My own opinion (and bearing in mind that advice on the Internet is usually worth what you pay for it ) is that I would not want a grade purely because it fitted in with the instructor's plans at the time. If he was grading you because he had seen you perform and thought you looked seriously under-graded that is one thing; but it seems to me that his motives are not entirely altruistic. Perhaps he needs you to have a black belt so that he can insure you?

I personally don't think I could accept such a garde. It seems that you have worked hard on many other martial arts achievements. Beware that you don't let one dodgy grade sully your reputations.

While it seems to totally contradict what I said above, I think this is also good advice. I forgot about the part where he wants you to teach. This was not the case in my situation.

I guess it comes down to this (please comment if you agree or disagree). If you feel you deserve the rank, then accept it. If you feel you are being given the rank because he needs a black belt to teach, then don't accept.

Good luck.

[YoungMan]

The only reason an Instructor should recommend and award a black belt is because he feels they are ready and have put the time and commitment in. Never because he wants someone to share teaching duties with him. Getting black belt is for your benefit, not his. It shows you have a solid grasp of basics, and should never be used to advance the Instructor's agenda (having an assistant). Being an assistant, if you are capable, is a nice side benefit of earning Dan rank, but should never be used to justify Dan rank. Some of our Instructors, I suspect, follow this path-recommending students to black belt in order to have more assistants, and it shows in the immaturity of their technique and lack of solid uinderstanding of basics. The black belt is for your credibility, not his.

[marie curie]

Lots to think about, thanks!

I have actually done the art before, Kieran, if you read my first post. I did 4 months, and I would be doing 6ish hardcore more months. That is 10 months total out of the 24 it typically takes.

When my instructor and I discussed it the first time, and I brought up a lower level, the concerns were three-fold:

1. Aside from the last 6 kicks and the forms (like 10 of them), I already know the curriculum... so I would, after the 6 months, know all of the curriculum and just be hanging out at a lower level.

2. I think, officially, because of my extraneous MA studies and his rank, he can just award me a black belt as long as I know the full curriculum, but if I have to go through it all, I have to pay for all the rankings. Since I'm going to be helping him out, and it isn't against the rules, I think he wants to help me out and not have me pay (a lot) for each ranking.

3. I may end up wanting to compete in the tournaments for this style in the area, and having lots of competition background, my instructor said that my rank would very possibly be questioned if I fought as something lower than a black belt... I may be able to get away with red, but I've been doing this (competing with similar enough rules) for a long time and it just wouldn't be fair to the people in my division who truly have only been doing this for 18 months if I fight at a lower rank.

As far as it being for his purposes and not for mine- well I had wanted to study, practice and compete in TKD, but the gradings are expensive (at least around here). So, I'm totally up for getting the opportunity to bypass that. Also, I like to teach, and think that this would be a good experience for me.

I'm less trying to justify and more looking for a dialog. One of the best things about the internet is that you can throw out a situation and get back lots of diverse viewpoints. Since I'm sure a good portion of you are smarter than me or are just coming from a different place, I want to see if anyone comes up with something that I haven't thought of.

Thanks again for all the responses!

[JackCrevalle]

[Edit: sorry I was trying to agree with an earlier poster and between my post and the one I was trying ot agree with several other responses got in. Then I screwed up who I was trying to agree with.]

I agree that you don't need your BB to get respect from students. In our dojang we have lesser ranked belts assisting the instructors.

This is, I believe, part of their training towards earning their black belts.

[bushido_man96]

From the scenarios that you just discussed, Marie, I think that it doesn't sound like it would really be compromising anyone's integrity, or anything like that. I think that if you feel comfortable doing it, then go for it.

[marie curie]

Thanks for the responses!