UFC _ Have any Karate Masters entered, and if so was result?

[bushido_man96]

Wasn't Norris' trademark a spinning back/hooking kick, though? I thought that I read that somewhere.

[YoungMan]

Just a theory, but it could be that one of the reasons why you don't see karate masters competing in MMA matches is that they feel they are past the point where competition is necessary or appropriate.

In WTF Tae Kwon Do (for example), eligibility is extended to 1st-3rd Dans. It is considered inappropriate for higher Dans (4th Dan+) to enter competitions.

It might just be that karate masters don't feel that entering ring or cage matches is appropriate for their rank and position. Keep in mind also, many legitimate masters are a bit older than your typical MMA fighter and don't want to risk injuring themselves in the name of sport.

[bushido_man96]

Those are good points, YoungMan. The UFC does appear to be a young person's game. Unless, of course, you are Randy Couture!

[YoungMan]

And yes, Norris' trademark technique in tournaments was the high back side kick which he learned in Korea studying Tang Soo Do. It worked because noone at the time knew how to counter it. This was in the mid-late sixties, and very few American fighters knew Korean techniques.

[DokterVet]

Just a theory, but it could be that one of the reasons why you don't see karate masters competing in MMA matches is that they feel they are past the point where competition is necessary or appropriate.

In WTF Tae Kwon Do (for example), eligibility is extended to 1st-3rd Dans. It is considered inappropriate for higher Dans (4th Dan+) to enter competitions.

It might just be that karate masters don't feel that entering ring or cage matches is appropriate for their rank and position. Keep in mind also, many legitimate masters are a bit older than your typical MMA fighter and don't want to risk injuring themselves in the name of sport.

As Bushido_man96 pointed out, the UFC heavyweight champion, Randy Couture, is 44 years old. Dan Severn is 53 and has already fought 7 times in 2007, winning 6 of those fights.

There are several other 40+ fighters out there competing as well.

Of course, not everyone can fight into middle age like these guys do. In fact, most people probably couldn't. But age definitely wouldn't keep every 40+ karate master from competing. So far I only know of only one to take up the challenge -- Ron Van Clief, who I mentioned earlier in the thread.

[YoungMan]

Then age aside, I think legitimate karate masters (those promoted by recognized organizations) probably feel that climbing into a cage to fight is inappropriate for someone of their rank and status.

They most likely feel they have nothing to prove, that what they practice is not a sport with which to win belts or money, and don't want that kind of publicity. They may have competed earlier on in their career, but possibly feel it is unnecessary now. That's what separates a true Master from simply a good fighter. Being a good fighter doesn't make you a Master.

Yeah, there are so-called Masters competing in tournaments, but I don't think they are the same type as the ones I mentioned above.

[bushido_man96]

Then age aside, I think legitimate karate masters (those promoted by recognized organizations) probably feel that climbing into a cage to fight is inappropriate for someone of their rank and status.

They most likely feel they have nothing to prove, that what they practice is not a sport with which to win belts or money, and don't want that kind of publicity. They may have competed earlier on in their career, but possibly feel it is unnecessary now. That's what separates a true Master from simply a good fighter. Being a good fighter doesn't make you a Master.

Yeah, there are so-called Masters competing in tournaments, but I don't think they are the same type as the ones I mentioned above.

I think that different people just like to express themselves different ways. Some like to do it while fighting, and some would rather not, as you mention for various, legitimate reasons.

What I don't like is when one talks down of the other for their viewpoint of how to express their style or art. If one master wants to be a fighter, then great, let them fight. If another doesn't want to fight, and feels that he has nothing to prove, then I think that is awesome. In the end, though, both should be given equal respect.

[Andrew_Patton]

yes, I was mistaken norris's trademark kick was a spin side-kick. but my point was back in the "good ole days" karate tournaments weren't as flashy and "pitter patter" as they are today, it was more basic and straightforward while being true to Karate's roots.

And, I don't remember if it's been mentioned before BUT Ryoto Machida trains with Blackhouse in the UK, the new home of Vitor Belfort, so I no longer consider him a Karate-practitioner, he's a boxer/thai boxer now to be honest. And Inoki Ichihara of old UFC fame was a Nidan or Shodan at the time and was being billed as either 5th or 6th when he went into fight at UFC 2...

At the time, I don't consider there being a great Karate practitioner in MMA fights, yet... that is to say, there's been good, but the "greats" either were to old at the time, OR are leading there own styles ala Matsui with kyokushin. On the other hand, Semmy Schilt, a higher student of Kyokushin has had one MMA fight IIRC, and was K-1 Grand Prix champ for a while there.

[Ace2021]

Someone said Machida trains in Blackhouse Gym, which is an MMA gym, true. But to say his style is not karate anymore is not true. Maybe not his whole style, but if you watch him fight, his stand-up is very smart and methodical, and the karate element can be clearly seen.

[bushido_man96]

Someone said Machida trains in Blackhouse Gym, which is an MMA gym, true. But to say his style is not karate anymore is not true. Maybe not his whole style, but if you watch him fight, his stand-up is very smart and methodical, and the karate element can be clearly seen.

I would agree with you. Those with experience in arts like Karate and TKD prior to their MMA careers don't just lose that knowledge. They retain it, adapt it, and add in the new concepts that they learn as well.