Student "busted" back to white belt

[pegasi]

In my school a student was demoted from blue (5th gup) back to white belt for misbehavior in class. The student had been given plenty of opportunities to correct his behavior and had not. The head instructor demoted the student and told him he had to start from white belt again or leave the school. He tested for his yellow belt last saturday and passed.

What do you all think of this? I think that the head instructor showed some compassion in giving the student the demotion and a chance to start over, instead of just kicking him out. He had basically been a "benign" disruption to classes, hadn't done anything mean to others, hurt anyone, etc.He hadn't listened when corrected about his disruptive behavior, and he got some major consequences.

Look at the lesson this kid, yes, a kid, learned by losing the rank it took over a year to get, and actually sticking it out and starting over. It took a lot of courage to stand up there and retest, with everyone knowing the rank that he'd had before. To me, this shows that the instructor's decision was the right one. It sure is one lesson that the kid will never forget!

Has anyone had a situation like this, where the student was demoted and given the chance to start again, instead of being summarily dismissed from the school?

[stoneheart]

I've never seen it happen before. Of course if I were the sensei, I would just kick the disruptive student out of class permanently. I'm not too big on the self-improvement aspects of karate. It is foremost a means of self-defense for me, and it is also a good workout when you practice hard. I don't want to hold the hand of someone who is not taking the class seriously, and if they are holding myself and others back from improving, I'd just as soon as they go play elsewhere.

[Adonis]

Thats good the kid stayed with it. Hopefully his behavior changes. Most people would quit. Glad he stayed with it.

It depends on the instructors judgement of the student, weather to kick him out or demote or other corrective action. Some look at it that they want to help others out and Martail Arts has done wonders in helping others change for the better.

It will be good for him in the long run for his martail arts too since he can go back to the basics and perfect them.

[lordtariel]

I've seen it happen at our dojo, but it's usually a yellow belt. This is an effective technique and I feel a necessary one. If you don't have the discipline to be a higher belt, you're not a higher belt, end of question. I think this is the correct way to handle that sort of situation. Sure, you could kick him out, but I would rather change his way of thinking rather than just get rid of him.

[bushido_man96]

I have never seen this happen on a permanent basis before, but have heard of it, and I do support it. I have stripped rank for the duration of a class, but not any more than that.

The most interesting aspect that I see is the fact that the student did not just quit, and try to sign up elsewhere. I think it shows a lot about his maturity. Either that, or his parents wouldn't let him quit.

[GOM]

I have had to hold students (children) back from gradings if their attitude has been bad, but have never stripped a student of their ranking.

[marie curie]

I've never seen this before- I don't know quite how I feel about it... I guess a certain level of maturity is expected with each rank, so it's reasonable. I just see a potential for abuse given the cost of testing being of benifit to the sensei.

[username8517]

I don't agree with stripping a rank for more than a class (and even then in rare situations), but I do give kudos to your instructor for letting him stay on and work his way back up. Hopefully it will be a humbling experience for the student.

In my view, once you earn a rank, you've earned it; it's not something that can be taken away. At our dojo we have a benign problem student as well who made it up to 5th kyu before these issues started. What happened was the head instructor and I had a talk with said student. We told her that her rank was earned but currently she wasn't showing the mentality required for it. So until she fixed that aspect of her training, we wouldn't be promoting her to the next rank.

After being denied the opportunity to test at the following promotion, the student more or less stopped coming (she still pops in about once a month for the past 9 months or so), but still has the same attitude. Guess that goes to show what's more important to some people.

[A_Train]

I'm not sure how I feel about rank demotion either, especially if he/she will be required to pay for testings again. I would prefer to see that student denied the right to test for the next upgrade rather than demotion.

Did this student develop the attitude, or was it always there and ignored until they reached blue belt?

Its interesting that they have stuck with it despite the demotion.

[Sensei Rick]

I have seen this and have done similar things. You may think the instructor had done a risky thing, after all the student could possibly quit. At one time, I was struggling financially and tried to save every student and tolerated the disruptive behavior. After all the kid is still in class and paying to be there so you are making something out of it. What you don’t realize is that the other parents, the ones whose kid isn’t being disruptive, don’t see the discipline aspect being taught in your class, and that may be the very reason they are bringing THEIR kid to class

When I do this, I always get questioned by a sempai or some other higher ranking students that have aspirations to become a sensei too. The disciplined student will only do one of 2 things…. He will either quit, or he will improve his behavior. Either way, sensei gets what he wants. (Read that last line again over and over, it’s very important.

Edited May 16, 2007 by Sensei Rick