Is budo missing in the MMA?

[marie curie]

I would agree if I thought that it was getting out of hand, but some healthy "You suck, I'm awesome" mindset for the fight I think helps the fighters. Also, there seems to be a healthy balance between hugs and praises for each other after the fights with the "I don't like this guy and he didn't bring it" type talking.

[Patrick]

Hello,

We have removed a post from this thread in error. It is quoted below. I apologize for the confusion. Thanks.

I really have mixed feeling about what MMA should be called or represent. I enjoy watching Ultimate Fighter, and I enjoy watching the matches. Some of these guys trained for years in one or more types of Martial Arts, boxing, and/or wrestling. Here is where I think it begins to change: They have schools opening now where you just go to learn to become a Mixed Martial Artist, so these new students arent even spending quality time in one or more styles, but many combined. Never learning the why's or how's behind a style. These new students aren't learning the respect or discipline one learns in a quality martial art school. Their goal is to learn how to fight, win matches, and not have respect for the person you just beat to the ground. But this is where I see Martial Arts heading. There are less and less traditional schools out there, and more competition type schools emerging.

Hmm. You say that MMA students aren't learning the whys or hows behind the styles that make up their MMA curriculum, which may be true, but since they are being taught a particular mix of MMA as its own style, are they not being taught the hows and whys of that style? An omoplata is still an omoplata and you still have to know the hows and whys whether you are going to fight on a mat or in a cage, in a gi or shirtless with TapouT shorts.

As for matters of respect, discipline, etc. I'm not so sure you'll find those in traditional (usually meaning "a few decades old") schools in any more abundance than you will at "competition type" schools (and I don't think the two ideas are mutually exclusive anyway). For every meathead MMA stereotype that exists there is a whiny, "I didn't come here to feel pain, let me pick up my supersized McBlackBelt combo at the next drive through window" stereotype related to some of the Korean, Japanese/Okinawan MAs. Neither connote respect.

As for learning to fight, well, that seems to be a missing element in many of the traditionally-flavoured dojangs/dojos. You seem to use the term in a pejorative sense. Why? If learning to fight is a bad thing, then we may as well stop teaching martial arts and start wearing gis to Tae Bo classes, then keep them on for ettiquite classes, because if you remove the part where you learn to fight, that's pretty much what's left.

I can tell you that if you are training in anything MMA-applicable or MMA-related, the respect and trust between training partners is virtually automatic, so much so that there isn't a great deal of time spent on verbalising that. It's obvious. You simply cannot spar with someone if you cannot trust that they aren't going to demonstrate a flaw in your defence by busting your face instead of poking a couple of controlled shots in and telling you to tuck your elbows in, or that they aren't going to crank an armbar to breaking point. And, sad to say, dissing isn't a part of our gradings. That would be fun.

Of course, there are people who make it through that type of training, in whatever configuration they do it, who are going to be disrespectful punks. It's hard to filter out the jerks, especially when they act respectfully in training, then go outside and act differently. But, I would say that has more to do with MMA being 'cool' right now than a systemic failure to breed a culture of respect. Remember when ninjas were cool - heck, can you see some of the people claiming to teach ninjutsu now? Remember karate, post-84?

Give other martial artists the same media platforms that the most famous MMA fighters now have and you'll see a whole new set of nice guys, average guys, and jerks.

[marie curie]

Great Post GZK! I think that's a good point about traditional and competitive martial arts and their level of respect, etc.

[bushido_man96]

Great Post GZK! I think that's a good point about traditional and competitive martial arts and their level of respect, etc.

I think that you make some very good points as well. Your last statement sticks out particularly.