The Reality Gap.

[bushido_man96]

Instructor: "Be aware. Oops, time for class to start. We're doing forms tonight."

In addition; If I make too strong a point, they'll tell me I'm being dissrespectful and make me do push-ups.

Think of it this way...the push-ups are making you stronger.

I actually address this kind of situation in the article I wrote a while ago. I think it is an important attribute of an instructor to be able to admit when he doesn't know the answer, and to point you in the direction to get the answer.

[The BB of C]

Push-ups do make one stronger. But I despise them so.

An instructor being able to admit he's wrong? I've been able to do that. But I have yet to meet a different instructor that can.

[ps1]

As an instructor of self defense in a credited state university I agree 100% with how self defense needs to be practiced. However, that should be the goal.

Remember, you need to crawl then walk then run. I begin by teaching different concepts (not necessarily a specific technique for a specific situation) in a step by step manner. By the end of the 15 week semester they are executing techniques pretty effectively. I also make sure that the final practical exam is against attackers my students have never met. I have them dress in masks and I turn the lights off and re-arrange the room to create obstacles. The attackers yell and scream (because it's a state university there's certain things they can't say). Each student is assigned a 15 minute time block. They know from the moment they enter the room to the moment they exit, they can be attacked at any time. They usually fare pretty well. I've never had someone perform absolutely perfect technique every time, but they don't freeze and they defend themselves well.

[The BB of C]

Ps1, please teach my class, Oh great one! That is a geinus way of training and seeing if a student actually learned the technique. I have never thought of that before. That has got to be a beyond awesome class to be in.

[bushido_man96]

Very nice, ps1. That is a great application to use in class, and I may have to work it into my curriculum in the future. I have a brother who would be perfect to put a mask on...5'10", 350+, strong as an ox....good to feel an attack from someone like that.

As for your statement that not everyone gets every technique 100% right, I feel that this is the most important thing you can do for them...as we all know, it will never work out perfectly. But, as my partner says, "if it works, then you didn't do it wrong." "Thrive in chaos," as W. Hock Hocheim would say.

[Sensei Tom OBrien]

ps1, Those are some great ideas for self defense. My style - Vee-Jitsu is seeped in self defense. When we are training for a tournament I am sorry because we get away from the street. Our style is combat oriented from Brooklyn, NY. We train for the street through repetition against real attacks. When someone is choking you they are not just placing their hands near your throat. When someone gets you in a headlock they are putting you in a vice grip not just holding their arms around your head. Our style is meant for self defense but we adjust for competition.

Thanks,

Sensei Tom

[baronbvp]

This is great stuff! The military trains this way very often in military combat arts, survival training, hostage training, etc. The value of training against an unpredictable, realistic opponent equally determined to win is what makes full contact sparring so worthwhile.

My school doesn't do things quite this exotic, but we do spar on Saturdays from the getgo all the way to submission or knock out. I haven't done it yet because I would be tapping soon after ending up on the ground, but it can get fairly...um...robust.

I think you are right on, cross. The more realistic, the better. I will mention these ideas to my instructor to see if we can have some more realistic sessions.

I love the testing you use, ps1 - a great idea. Obviously, people have to agree to be trained this way before hand, but I haven't seen anyone who didn't think it valuable afterward.

One thing this kind of training can lead to is an honest assessment by people about whether they are really prepared to do what it takes to resolve a situation. If anything, I think most people realize even more that street fighting or threat defense is not a game. They soberly remind themselves not to get involved in situations that don't concern them.

[The BB of C]

Let's not forget that not everyone joins martial arts for self defense. But if you're claiming you teach self defense, I think you should really make sure that you're not just a Tae Bo class minus the music and the tight pants AKA what most "self defense" martial arts schools I've seen are.

[bushido_man96]

Let's not forget that not everyone joins martial arts for self defense.

This is a good point. However, I do think that whatever reason one joins the Martial Arts for, good self-defense should be a by-product of the training.

[dragonwarrior_keltyr]

Ps1, please teach my class, Oh great one! That is a geinus way of training and seeing if a student actually learned the technique. I have never thought of that before. That has got to be a beyond awesome class to be in.

Mine too! I think that's pretty great. While my sensei does not do anything like that he will show us and talk about practical/street defense and different things like that. In the higher rank classes we work on more self defense things such as holds, grappling. In one class we all had to feel what it was like to be choked. Very good classes those are.