Male VS Female sparring matches-PLEASE advise

[akedm]

You're welcome NinjaNurse. I've enjoyed looking through the older threads, since really nothing goes out of style, and I guess I had to get my two cents off my chest too.

I choose to enter the ring knowing full well the risks and benefits

Sounds like you have no distractions in the ring. I'd have trepidations for two reasons, neither of them are my ego. After all you paid hard-earned money to get beat on by another student (it's in the fine print).

Ego is an excuse, but perhaps a valid one for some and for insecure people trying to do better, it may be a situation they'll have to work themselves into. Nothing wrong with trying to get over insecurities, as long as it's not 'chest-thumping' insecurities.

Anyway, for me first it's my height. I've learned to be gentle cause I grew tall, big and strong fast, but I was awkward and clumsy like it was written on my forehead. And I could knock over someone walking without knowing it. I was the standard example for show and tell by the gym teacher: 'Ok here's how you defend against the really tall guy. Tall guy come up here so I can show the class how it's done. Whack whack whack! Ok thank you tall guy.' Ugh. I could pick up the biggest rock (boy stuff), yet I'd reach to put my arm around my date and end up clocking her upside the head with my elbow. So I kept it toned down cause of my size, strength and leverage.

So for me unless you're my height, it's ingrained and it'd be a little hard for me to go from standard operating 70% and really careful to cutting loose closer to 100% and actually wanting to make contact with you over and over. My brain would be screaming to stop! Hence the training, right? Yep!

And second there's a general mindset I think men have about violence rooted in culture and history. Men are the ones who start wars, men are the criminals, men shoot each other over anything, men rape, men are the bloodthirsty conquers in history, the dictators are men, the war criminals are men, Genghis Kahn, Pol Pok, Hitler, Saddam, Napoleon, men are by and large the violent ones ready to spill blood if need be and that's who we're expecting to face when we step up. And I think this 'memory' comes to bear like an unexpected hic-cup when faced against a woman so ready for blood (so to speak) and a look in her eye that tell us 'ready or not'. For me at least it's not in the forefront of my mind, but when some of us become aware of it, it makes us say 'whoa. This is unexpected.' Like you truly are from Venus at that moment.

For example remember when we all first heard about female suicide bombers. I know a lot of men were saying, 'What'? It took a moment to expect that of a woman. And like this female Sunday school teacher who raped and killed that 8 year-old-girl? I know most everyone men and women in the nation said, 'What? A woman?' And I know everyone tried to think back to the last time anything like that happened. If it were a man, it'd be sadly expected for the crime. None of us here would say, 'What? A man did that?'

So while my distractions wouldn't be ego they would be a distractions nonetheless, and if I were up against you Ninja, disastrous for me too.

Facing a woman like the original poster did gives most men pause the first few times I'm sure, maybe every time, for a number of reasons. I relate to his trepidation.

i very much appreciate your post, NinjaNurse! Your quote is invaluable! Thank you.

[JusticeZero]

Men, get over it and spar with us! I choose to enter the ring knowing full well the risks and benefits..

Yeah, see this is the attitude I like to see! This is pretty much how women -should- be thinking if they want to get the most out of their training. It's when certain women come into a class expecting to be babied and given preferential and easy treatment that I become frustrated; I don't quite know how to respond to students who act like that.

[The BB of C]

Men, get over it and spar with us! I choose to enter the ring knowing full well the risks and benefits..

Yeah, see this is the attitude I like to see! This is pretty much how women -should- be thinking if they want to get the most out of their training. It's when certain women come into a class expecting to be babied and given preferential and easy treatment that I become frustrated; I don't quite know how to respond to students who act like that.

Tell them to take two gigantic doses of reality can call you in the morning

I'm such a jerk sometimes.

In all seriousness though. I've had to tell a lot of ladies getting into martial arts about that. "Newsflash, buddy. This is martial arts. It's about fighting. You can't learn to fight unless you get in shape and you can't get in shape unless you push yourself like a beast. Your gender has nothing to do with it."

[Throwdown0850]

how the h**l do you fight a girl? I couldnt! I punched her a few times in the chest during a class match,where everybody watches 2 randomly picked people fight (she was a yellow belt also,but had a chest protector,I used the instructors stuff since mine is coming next week) and she just threw her headgear off and yelled:"stop punching me in private places!!!" ,guess what,I had to do 50 burpies (push-up position,bring feet close while in push up position,jump,repeat) and 10 minutes in "horse stance" on the wall,then I had a good yell-at from the instructor for almost 5 minutes in the bathroom ,trust me,its the scariest thing in your whole life,so yeah,I need some advice on sparring with a female,can someone PLEASE help?

I understand what you are saying here, she is there to spar with you, if she doesnt want to get hit in the chest, then she shouldnt spar, period.. and for your instructor yelling at you, that is ridiculous.. you didnt do anything wrong. looks like the girl needs to grow up and spar or leave.

[joesteph]

Men, get over it and spar with us! I choose to enter the ring knowing full well the risks and benefits . . .

I believe that when someone chooses a martial art, and a school to train in, the facts should be gotten from the chief instructor as to the rules of the school as well as what the art entails.

The school in question in the OP has contact sparring, and protective gear is worn. I do not know the level of contact permitted, but whatever it may be, the rules of the school should be made clear to all students regarding contact by the chief instructor. A rule for all students may be no strikes to the groin area. There is protective gear for men and women available in the event of an accidental strike there. I was already aware of the special chest protection for women that was posted, but I'm glad the link was posted in case a woman or even an instructor wants this added protection worn. It may or may not be needed, as there are already protective vests available but, again, the level of contact rule of a school and the possibility of an accident may be factors.

The information in the OP tells me that the school is not properly run. The instructor had obviously not established rules for all to know, or else there would not have been confusion.

I quoted from your posting, Heidi, because it does refer to getting over it. I would suggest that if men and women join a school that has rules known to all that permit a higher level of contact, equal for both sexes, then yes, the men would be expected to adjust accordingly. If the man does not agree, then he really should not train at that school, just as if a woman does not agree, then she should not train there either. I do not see it as a flaw in a man if he needs time to adjust. I believe that he's resocializing, and at the same time understands that this resocialization is limited to the confines of the school.

EDIT: Done to shorten the posting

Edited May 24, 2009 by joesteph

[Scott_LIFE180]

I'm sorry for not reading all 7 pages of this post but in my opinoin there is a huge difference between sparing a girl and hitting her in the chest (especially when wearing chest protection) and groping/molestation of any sort. I honestly feel little to no sympothy for the girl.

If I had to spar with her after an episode like that, I would do as some of my fellow posters have said and target other areas of the body. She may not get the training she really needs to defend against an attacker but I wont give her any more grounds to complain against me.

Also this has brought to my attention some things that I should do before sparing with a girl. I think first and foremost I should try to find out if there are any special restrictions for our match and what the dojo/school's rules are for such a match up.

[sensei8]

Men VS Women during sparring. Men, be careful. Women, be careful. Sparring is sparring no matter the gender. Wear the protective gear and go onto the floor and....really go for it. Whom stands before me during Kumite has no bearing as to what it is that I must do. Worrying about the gender only disrupts Mind Like Water/Mind Like Moon, therefore, clear the mind.

How's either gender going to know how to properly defend themselfs when it will truly count out in the streets? Have a responsible instructor monitoring all the sparring for proper technique and safety at all times. After that...whack away.

[Montana]

You don't need advice on how to spar with a female, you need to find another school. If the instructor does not inform you ahead of time, you should spar with the same rules and guidelines for all of your sparing partners.

Agreed. In my school, everybody is equal. We don't make a big deal about the genders.

The groin to the head are targets and you either protect them, ot get hit., You learn real fast that way.

Now don't misunderstand me here...if a man intentionally starts attacking a womans breasts in other than normal sparring sense, he will be pulled aside and talked to about it and it will either stop, or he will be either excluded from sparring until he shapes up, or expelled if he doesn't.

We don't use "gear" as a general rule (you won't have it on the street) unless the individual wants to get their own and use it. You learn to block or take the hit.

[sensei8]

I'm for safety at all times. I'm aware of the sensitivity as far as striking the breast and it's medical implications. Having said that, I'm not for treating my female students different than my male students. I'm also not into giving my female students any sense of false-securities. Therefore, either learn to block or get hit. If they can't block...then it's time to buy a chest protector...or try bowling.

[RW]

This is an interesting topic. If you're going to "exclude" some areas, then, how can you spar with a female? The idea of kicking or punching the face of a girl even when sparring is a no-no for me, and many guys, even though when in theory you can.

Body shots are ok, but there's always the chance you can accidentally hit them in the chest, with the consequence that the topic creator mentioned.

At least in my style, low shots (i.e. thighs, calves, groin, sweeps, etc) are not allowed in sparring. So where does that leave a guy sparring with a girl with? Running around and trying to land the perfect, no-risk-of-accident stomach shot?

It's funny, in my style, face punches are not allowed, nor do guys use a cup and nor do girls use a chest protector (groin shots are not allowed though), and there was this one girl that would anyway always go for the groin when sparring ("accidentally")... it annoyed me off a lot.